u/FantasyLovingWriter

They are so boringly simple or one dimensional and sometimes both. They aren’t fun and often give monologues that bluntly say what they are about with no nuance or subtly and they aren’t smart either. The lead government guy in Season 4 sounds like a broken record half the time, (and being the worse one in this archetype) Dr. Brenner literally used the same tactic to get their way until Eleven eventually gave in like how a child throws a tantrum until a parent gives in, opposed to smart villains like Hannibal Lecter from Silence of the Lambs where he adapts to the situation and comes up with a different plan every time.

Also they are written to either be hate sink and agonizing to watch or given a redemption arc which loses the joy and fun to have villains in a story. Because villains like: Disney villains (most notably: Maleficent, Creulla De Vil and Ursula), the Joker, most Stephen King villains, (most notably Pennywise the Clown) Fairy Godmother from Shrek 2, Lord Shen, Death the big bad wolf, Regina George, Azula, Bettlejuice, Sue Sylvester from Glee, Tammy Swanson and Jean Ralphio from Parks and Rec, most Marvel villains (most notably Thanos) and Palpatine are loved by their fans not because they had a redemption arc, but because they were unabashedly, unapologetically, and deviously evil.

What are your opinions on this?

They are so boringly simple or one dimensional and sometimes both. They aren’t fun and often give monologues that bluntly say what they are about with no nuance or subtly and they aren’t smart either. Eve’s father sounds like a broken record half the time, (and being the worse one in this archetype) the empire literally used the same tactic to get their way until Mark eventually gave in like how a child throws a tantrum until a parent gives in, opposed to smart villains like Hannibal Lecter from Silence of the Lambs where he adapts to the situation and comes up with a different plan every time.

Also they are written to either be hate sink and agonizing to watch or given a redemption arc which loses the joy and fun to have villains in a story. Because villains like: Disney villains (most notably: Maleficent, Creulla De Vil and Ursula), the Joker, most Stephen King villains, (most notably Pennywise the Clown) Fairy Godmother from Shrek 2, Lord Shen, Death the big bad wolf, Regina George, Azula, Bettlejuice, Sue Sylvester from Glee, Tammy Swanson and Jean Ralphio from Parks and Rec, most Marvel villains (most notably Thanos) and Palpatine are loved by their fans not because they had a redemption arc, but because they were unabashedly, unapologetically, and deviously evil.

I hated Omni Man in the show and would have loved him and his redemption arc if they committed to him being 100% evil in season 1 and got remorse in later seasons (preferably late season 2 where the seeds start planting)

What are your opinions on this?

Everywhere I go I see forums and posts online bashing on Angela because she’s a bully who hurt Eleven and they are often the same type of post over and over again which gets really old after a while, it’s been 4 years, the character only appeared in 3 episodes and adds nothing to the plot, they need to move on already! She’s extremely boring as I legit fell asleep during the stake incident because of how cheesy, cliche, unrealistic, and mind numbingly stupid the scene is (which distracts the audience from Eleven’s derailment that started in s4 and ended with the awful finale) its like they have never seen a tv show or movie where the villain is the most memorable and beloved character? In pop culture: Maleficent, Creulla De Vil, the Joker, most Stephen King villains, Lord Shen, Death the big bad wolf, Regina George, Azula, Bettlejuice, Sue Sylvester, Tammy Swanson, most Marvel villains, and Palpatine are loved by their fans not because they got a redemption arc, but because they were deliciously, unabashedly, and unapologetically evil and are still relevant to this day because they are often the best characters from their respective medias.

They need to reminded that all that type of hate is what lead to Angela’s actress getting harassed online, I swear those people hyper fixate on the wrong things, I even see bad faith criticism towards Steve (especially by the Nancy and Dustin stans) where they point out how awful he is when that is blatantly the point as he grows and learns from said mistakes (it’s called character development) they should pick on a character that’s actually problematic: Hopper who’s character is inconsistent and borderline abusive whereas in season 3 alone he: threatened to kill a minor, acted entitled towards his crush and treated her like property after he boyfriend died saving her and him (who by the way was more compatible with) and had unnecessary violent outbursts over the smallest things and this is treated as comedy, WHAT?!

No one in this show is a saint, no one! Maybe Bob is, but no one is in this show is 100% perfect, people are flawed and the character arcs and villains are meant to be enjoyable rather than create a million threads about black and white morality when that’s not life at all!

I even saw someone in the comment section on a post say: “Max was good in season 4, but she was distant, aloof, and pushed people away and that’s a bad thing!” Of course that’s bad, that’s the entire lesson of her arc. Also her acting that way is extremely realistic considering her home life and how she hasn’t known the main cast for very long (almost 2 years of her life) and her feelings towards Billy are extremely grey which is also realistic opposed to the purists who claim everything is black and white.

If they are going to criticize aspects of this show, they should try to think of the big picture rather than be biased because there’s a reason why Steve and Vecna are so beloved because of how realistic they are and how entertaining they are. They act like these are people you know of real life which they are not! They are fictional and this show is for entertainment above all else and if this show was released in the 80s this bad faith criticism wouldn’t happen as fans are less biased and hypersensitive because god forbid we show uncomfortable scenes of bullies even thought it’s portrayed as bad and only portrayed in a negative light. All shows can’t be preschool shows where nothing bad happens as that’s not life and we need a dose of reality and to acknowledge the bad parts of life because we can learn from them and appreciate what the villains represent thematically.

Everywhere I go I see post bashing on Angela because she’s a bully who hurt Eleven and they are often the same type of post over and over again which gets really old after a while, it’s been 4 years, the character only appeared in 3 episodes and adds nothing to the plot, move on already! She’s extremely boring as I legit fell asleep during the stake incident because of how cheesy, cliche, unrealistic, and mind numbingly stupid the scene is (which distracts the audience from Eleven’s derailment that started in s4 and ended with the awful finale) have any of you seen a tv show or movie where the villain is the most loved, memorable, and beloved character? In pop culture: Maleficent, Creulla De Vil, the Joker, most Stephen King villains, Lord Shen, Death the big bad wolf, Regina George, Azula, Bettlejuice, and Palpatine are loved by their fans not because they got a redemption arc, but because they were deliciously, unabashedly, and unapologetically evil and are still relevant to this day because they are the best characters from their respective medias.

Do I need to remind you all that this type of hate is what lead to her actress getting harassed online, I swear you people hyper fixate on the wrong things, I even see bad faith criticism towards Steve (especially by the Nancy and Dustin stans) where they point out how awful he is when that is blatantly the point as he grows and learns from said mistakes (it’s called character development) you guys should pick on a character that’s actually problematic: Hopper who’s character is inconsistent and borderline abusive.

No one in this show is a saint, no one! Maybe Bob is, but no one is in this show is 100% perfect, people are flawed and the character arcs and villains are meant to be enjoyable rather than create a million threads about black and white morality when that’s not life at all!

I even saw someone in the comment section on a post say: “Max was good in season 4, but she was distant, aloof, and pushed people away and that’s a bad thing!” Of course that’s bad, that’s the entire lesson of her arc. Also her acting that way is extremely realistic considering her home life and how she didn’t spend as much time in Hawkins with the main cast compared to everyone in season 1. Also her feelings towards Billy are extremely grey which is also realistic opposed to the purists who claim everything is black and white.

If you are going to criticize aspects of this show, try to think of the big picture rather than be biased because there’s a reason why Steve and Vecna are so beloved because of how realistic they are and how entertaining they are. You all act like these are people you know of real life which they are not! They are fictional and this show is for entertainment above all else and if this show was released in the 80s this bad faith criticism wouldn’t happen as fans are less biased and hypersensitive because god forbid we show uncomfortable scenes of bullies even thought it’s portrayed as bad and only portrayed in a negative light. All shows can’t be preschool shows where nothing bad happens as that’s not life and we need a dose of reality and to acknowledge the bad parts of life because we can learn from them and appreciate what the villains represent thematically.

Jerri Manthey (2, 8, 20)
Sean Rector (4)
Neleh Dennis (4)
Rob Cesternino (6, 8)
Danielle DiLorenzo (12, 20)
Jonathan Penner (13, 16, 25)
Courtney Yates (15, 20)
Natalie Tenerelli (22)
Abi-Maria Gomes (25, 31)
Reiman Bledsoe (28, 31)
Jeremy Collins (29, 31, 40)
Cydney Gillon (32)
Domenick Abbate (36)
Davie Rickenbacker (37)
Elaine Scott (39)
Mike Turner (42)
Maryanne Oketch (42)
Jesse Lopez (43)
Carolyn Wiger (44)
Sabiyah Broderick (45)
Caleb Gebrewood (45)
Katurah Topps (45)
Tevin Davis (46)
Rome Coonley (47)

These are the alternates of 50 by the way, and the bold highlight means they are pervious winners

He was the worst part of the movie, so annoying especially when he cried, he’s so whiny and annoying and accomplished absolutely nothing to the point where he might just be filler, and the kid doesn’t need a blanket and blanky has unhealthy attachment issues

Mario Kart 64 is that game

1, 2, 3, Superstars, Jamboree

I would erase Waluigi, the blanket from Brave Little Toaster, Yoda, all the bioncle cast, all the morally correct people from Total Drama, and all the dragon types from Pokémon.

Here are my reasons why: filler character, annoying, preachy, not my thing and never saw the appeal, villains are more fun, and the type is overpowered.

Characters:
Donkey Kong Jr. (SNES/Tour)
Paratroopa (GCN)
Diddy Kong (GCN/Wii/NS)
Petey Piranha (GCN/NS)
Funky Kong (Wii/NS)
Dixie Kong (Tour)
King Bob-Omb (Tour)
Poochy (Tour)
Baby Wario (New Driver)
Baby Donkey Kong (New Driver)
Cup 1:
DS Figure-8 Circuit (New Retro)
3DS Daisy Hills (Tour)
GCN Mushroom Bridge (DS, Tour)
3DS Wuhu Loop/Maka Wuhu (New Retro)
Cup 2:
SNES Donut Plains 1, 2, 3 (DS, Tour, Wii U/NS)
GBA Luigi Circuit (DS, Tour)
GBA Lakeside Park (Tour)
3DS DK Jungle (Wii U/NS)
Cup 3:
3DS Music Park (Wii U/NS)
Tour Piranha Plant Pipeline (New Retro)
DS Luigi’s Mansion (7, Tour)
N64 Frappe Snowland (DS, Tour)
Cup 4:
GBA Cheep-Cheep Island (Tour)
Wii Dry Dry Ruins (Tour)
Wii Grumble Volcano (Wii U/NS)
GCN Bowser’s Castle (New Retro)
Battle Maps:
GBA Battle Course 1 (3DS/Tour)
GCN Cookie Land (Wii/Tour)
DS Twilight House (Wii/Tour)
Wii Block Plaza (New Retro)
Modes:
200cc (for race tracks)
Costumes:
Musician Mario (Tour)
Lederhosen Luigi (Tour)
Wedding Peach (Tour)
Black Kangaroo Yoshi (Tour)
Christmas Bowser (Tour)
Yellow Pit Crew Toad (Tour)
Gladiator Donkey Kong (Tour)
Hiker Wario (Tour)
Thai Daisy (Tour)
Koala Baby Mario (Tour)
Astronaut Toadette (Tour)
Pirate Bowser Jr. (Tour)
Bus Driver Waluigi (Tour)
Gold Petey Piranha (Tour)
Luigi’s Mansion King Boo (Tour)
Gold King Boo (Tour)
Gold Dry Bones (Tour)
Pink Chef Shy Guy (Tour)
Yellow Ninja Shy Guy (Tour)
Cherub Baby Peach (Tour)
Halloween Rosalina (Tour)
Chef Rosalina (Tour)
Gold Wiggler (Tour)
Red Party Time Lakitu (Tour)
Detective Baby Rosalina (Tour)
Cowboy Pauline (Tour)
Rose Pauline (Tour)
Ice Hammer Bro. (Tour)
Gold Chagrin’ Chuck (Tour)
Different Colors for Koopa Troopa, Toad, Birdo, Shy Guy
Vehicles:
Barrel Train (GCN/3DS/Tour)
Goo-Goo Buggy (GCN/Tour)
Poltergeist 4000 (DS/Tour)
Egg 1 (DS/3DS/Tour)
Super Blooper (Wii/Tour)
Wild Wing (Wii/Tour)
Flame Flyer (Wii/Tour)
Birthday Girl (3DS/Tour)
Double-Decker (Tour)
Clanky Kart (Tour)

Characters:
Donkey Kong Jr. (SNES/Tour)
Paratroopa (GCN)
Diddy Kong (GCN/Wii/NS)
Petey Piranha (GCN/NS)
Funky Kong (Wii/NS)
Dixie Kong (Tour)
King Bob-Omb (Tour)
Poochy (Tour)
Baby Wario (New Driver)
Baby Donkey Kong (New Driver)
Cup 1:
DS Figure-8 Circuit (New Retro)
3DS Daisy Hills (Tour)
GCN Mushroom Bridge (DS, Tour)
3DS Wuhu Loop/Maka Wuhu (New Retro)
Cup 2:
SNES Donut Plains 1, 2, 3 (DS, Tour, Wii U/NS)
GBA Luigi Circuit (DS, Tour)
GBA Lakeside Park (Tour)
3DS DK Jungle (Wii U/NS)
Cup 3:
3DS Music Park (Wii U/NS)
Tour Piranha Plant Pipeline (New Retro)
DS Luigi’s Mansion (7, Tour)
N64 Frappe Snowland (DS, Tour)
Cup 4:
GBA Cheep-Cheep Island (Tour)
Wii Dry Dry Ruins (Tour)
Wii Grumble Volcano (Wii U/NS)
GCN Bowser’s Castle (New Retro)
Battle Maps:
GBA Battle Course 1 (3DS/Tour)
GCN Cookie Land (Wii/Tour)
DS Twilight House (Wii/Tour)
Wii Block Plaza (New Retro)
Modes:
200cc (for race tracks)
Costumes:
Musician Mario (Tour)
Lederhosen Luigi (Tour)
Wedding Peach (Tour)
Black Kangaroo Yoshi (Tour)
Christmas Bowser (Tour)
Yellow Pit Crew Toad (Tour)
Gladiator Donkey Kong (Tour)
Hiker Wario (Tour)
Thai Daisy (Tour)
Koala Baby Mario (Tour)
Astronaut Toadette (Tour)
Pirate Bowser Jr. (Tour)
Bus Driver Waluigi (Tour)
Gold Petey Piranha (Tour)
Luigi’s Mansion King Boo (Tour)
Gold King Boo (Tour)
Gold Dry Bones (Tour)
Pink Chef Shy Guy (Tour)
Yellow Ninja Shy Guy (Tour)
Cherub Baby Peach (Tour)
Halloween Rosalina (Tour)
Chef Rosalina (Tour)
Gold Wiggler (Tour)
Red Party Time Lakitu (Tour)
Detective Baby Rosalina (Tour)
Cowboy Pauline (Tour)
Rose Pauline (Tour)
Ice Hammer Bro. (Tour)
Gold Chagrin’ Chuck (Tour)
Different Colors for Koopa Troopa, Toad, Birdo, Shy Guy
Vehicles:
Barrel Train (GCN/3DS/Tour)
Goo-Goo Buggy (GCN/Tour)
Poltergeist 4000 (DS/Tour)
Egg 1 (DS/3DS/Tour)
Super Blooper (Wii/Tour)
Wild Wing (Wii/Tour)
Flame Flyer (Wii/Tour)
Birthday Girl (3DS/Tour)
Double-Decker (Tour)
Clanky Kart (Tour)

I found it odd he didn’t include that but I guess he just forgot, since that Moana Cinematic Universe video, the only time those are omitted are the director/actor filmography rankings which made sense as mainstream animation wasn’t the focus

Did anyone else find that weird?

My recommendation is Angel’s Egg as that has a villain to took advantage over prey in a mature way like the Kung Fu Panda trilogy

And is it a good way to finish my DreamWorks marathon?

Best Animated Feature (3): Shrek 1, Incredibles 1, WALL-E
Walt Disney Animation Studios (11): Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs, Pinocchio, Fantasia, Dumbo, Bambi, Cinderella, Lady and the Tramp, Sleeping Beauty, The Little Mermaid, Beauty and the Beast, The Lion King
Star Wars (3): A New Hope, The Empire Strikes Back, Return of the Jedi
DreamWorks (1): Shrek 1
Pixar (3): Toy Story 1, Incredibles 1, WALL-E
Ghibli: none for obvious reasons
Sony Pictures Animation: none right now
Blue Sky: none right now
Illumination: none right now
Disney Direct-to-DVD Sequels: none right now
Wes Anderson (2): Rushmore, The Grand Budapest Hotel
Steven Spielberg (7): Jaws, Close Encounters of the Third Kind, Raiders of the Lost Ark, E.T. the Extra Terrestrial, Jurassic Park 1, Schindler’s List, Saving Private Ryan
Christopher Nolan (3): Memento, The Dark Knight, Inception
George Miller: none right now
James Cameron (3): The Terminator, Terminator 2: Judgement Day, Titanic
Muppets (1): The Muppet Movie (1979)
Tim Hill: none right now
Pixar Shorts (2): Luxo Jr., Tin Toy
Tim Burton: none right now
Paul Thomas Anderson: none right now
Adam Sandler: none right now

Note: all the films listed are ones that are already inducted

Why did they have a subplot about Ross telling Phoebe about he and Rachel were still married that ultimately went no where as Rachel found out on her own, if Phoebe immediately told Rachel, it would have have Rachel moving in with Phoebe feel more earned than it already does (which feels like a last resort after being annoyed by Joey and Ross which let’s be real were probably the better cheaper choices)

I personally like most of them and think they are mostly a good part of the story.

Yes they are unlikable, commit heinous acts, and and in some cases bigots but that’s the whole point, they are supposed to be that way and they serve as a plot device to raise stakes and in some cases be a perfect foil to the hero. Did you seriously expect the villains to be nice and considerate people?

We shouldn’t want to emulate them or look up to them, but we should appreciate them as an important part of the story as without them, there is no conflict.

For some people I can see why they would feel uncomfortable with certain villains but these are fictional characters based of real types of people from the 80s, they AREN’T real people! I even heard that one of the actors who played Angela in Season 4 was harassed (for the whooping three episodes she was in and her character in general can be easily cut out of the story with very little changing) which is so wrong on so many levels.

Has anyone ever seen a Disney movie where the villains are the most memorable and enjoyable part of the film? Characters like Creulla De Vil, Maleficent, Ursula, Jafar, Captain Hook, and Scar are people you would want to avoid in real life but you want to enjoy in a story because of how entertaining they are. Billy is a contender for my favorite character in the show because of how threatening he is, how he serves as a perfect foil to Steve Harrington, how he is the manifestation of what Max could have become if she never made true friends, and that it was difficult to take him down.

Characters like these are always more fun to watch in my opinion opposed to heroes (who are most often not the most boring self interest characters you can think of) and I hope everyone shares the same sentiments.

That’s my opinions on the subject, what are yours?

Characters:
Donkey Kong Jr. (SNES/Tour)
Diddy Kong (GCN/Wii/NS)
Petey Piranha (GCN/NS)
Funky Kong (Wii/NS)
Dixie Kong (Tour)
King Bob-Omb (Tour)
Poochy (Tour)
King K. Rool
Baby Wario
Baby Waluigi
Cup 1:
DS Figure-8 Circuit (New Retro)
3DS Daisy Hills (Tour)
GBA Cheep-Cheep Island (Tour)
DS Delfino Square (Wii)
Cup 2:
N64 Frappe Snowland (DS/Tour)
GBA Luigi Circuit (DS/Tour)
N64 D.K.’s Jungle Parkway (Wii)
DS Luigi’s Mansion (3DS/Tour)
Cup 3:
GCN Mushroom City (New)
SNES Donut Plains 1, 2, 3 (DS/Tour/Wii U)
Tour Piranha Plant Pipeline (New Retro)
GBA Sunset Wilds (NS)
Cup 4:
Wii Dry Dry Ruins (Tour)
Tour Yoshi’s Island (NS)
GBA Sky Garden (DS/NS)
GBA Rainbow Road (New Retro)
Battle Maps:
N64 Double Deck (New Retro)
GBA Battle Course 1 (3DS/Tour)
DS Twilight House (Wii/Tour)
Wii Funky Stadium (New Retro)
Modes:
Shine Runners (Battle Mode)
200cc (for race tracks)
Costumes:
Christmas Bowser (Tour)
Pink Donkey Kong Jr.
Yellow Pit Crew Toad (Tour)
Gladiator Donkey Kong (Tour)
Green Striker Birdo
Koala Baby Mario (Tour)
Farmer Baby Luigi
Kiddy Kong Diddy Kong
Pirate Bowser Jr. (Tour)
Gold Petey Piranha
Luigi’s Mansion King Boo (Tour)
Gold Dry Bones (Tour)
Pink Chef Shy Guy (Tour)
Mechanic Funky Kong
Gold Wiggler (Tour)
Party Lakitu (Tour)
Cowboy Pauline (Tour)
Vehicles:
Barrel Train (GCN/3DS/Tour)
Bullet Blaster (GCN/Tour)
Poltergeist 4000 (DS/Tour)
Egg 1 (DS/3DS/Tour)
Wario Bike (Wii)
Magikruser (Wii)
Flame Runner (Wii)
Birthday Girl (3DS/Tour)
Double-Decker (Tour)
Clanky Kart (Tour)

Characters:
Donkey Kong Jr. (SNES/Tour)
Diddy Kong (GCN/Wii/NS)
Petey Piranha (GCN/NS)
Funky Kong (Wii/NS)
Dixie Kong (Tour)
King Bob-Omb (Tour)
Poochy (Tour)
King K. Rool
Baby Wario
Baby Waluigi
Cup 1:
DS Figure-8 Circuit (New Retro)
3DS Daisy Hills (Tour)
GBA Cheep-Cheep Island (Tour)
DS Delfino Square (Wii)
Cup 2:
N64 Frappe Snowland (DS/Tour)
GBA Luigi Circuit (DS/Tour)
N64 D.K.’s Jungle Parkway (Wii)
DS Luigi’s Mansion (3DS/Tour)
Cup 3:
GCN Mushroom City (New)
SNES Donut Plains 1, 2, 3 (DS/Tour/Wii U)
Tour Piranha Plant Pipeline (New Retro)
GBA Sunset Wilds (NS)
Cup 4:
Wii Dry Dry Ruins (Tour)
Tour Yoshi’s Island (NS)
GBA Sky Garden (DS/NS)
GBA Rainbow Road (New Retro)
Battle Maps:
N64 Double Deck (New Retro)
GBA Battle Course 1 (3DS/Tour)
DS Twilight House (Wii/Tour)
Wii Funky Stadium (New Retro)
Modes:
Shine Runners (Battle Mode)
200cc (for race tracks)
Costumes:
Christmas Bowser (Tour)
Pink Donkey Kong Jr.
Yellow Pit Crew Toad (Tour)
Gladiator Donkey Kong (Tour)
Green Striker Birdo
Koala Baby Mario (Tour)
Farmer Baby Luigi
Kiddy Kong Diddy Kong
Pirate Bowser Jr. (Tour)
Gold Petey Piranha
Luigi’s Mansion King Boo (Tour)
Gold Dry Bones (Tour)
Pink Chef Shy Guy (Tour)
Mechanic Funky Kong
Gold Wiggler (Tour)
Party Lakitu (Tour)
Cowboy Pauline (Tour)
Vehicles:
Barrel Train (GCN/3DS/Tour)
Bullet Blaster (GCN/Tour)
Poltergeist 4000 (DS/Tour)
Egg 1 (DS/3DS/Tour)
Wario Bike (Wii)
Magikruser (Wii)
Flame Runner (Wii)
Birthday Girl (3DS/Tour)
Double-Decker (Tour)
Clanky Kart (Tour)