u/Next_Exercise6852

Short answer: because other guys fucked up a good thing before you.

What we did earlier was submitting docs for background check before the person even took off to Ukraine.

Like you arrive and the SBU background check is ready, you only need to do the stuff which doesn't take long.

Yet after dozens of no-shows (yes, including those who swore with their life they are so definitely coming, sent itineraries and whatnot), the Foreign Recruiting Centers only initiate the check once you are physically there.
There will be no moral to the story. It is what it is.

I had numerous such enquiries so here you go.

Provided you want to continue serving in another unit in Ukraine, your options are:

- provide credible recommendations who will convey unit's/their own perspective on the situation;

- join a unit who takes people who left on bad terms while simply "believing" their stories.

All others should be vetted, but not you, because "but hey, it's ME!!!". No, it doesn't work this way.

Here comes the next point: "They were all bastards, all corrupt/butchers/retards". So your point is: there are 5 officers and 13 sergeants in a company, and there is not a single person of authority who is not corrupt and would care to take a 15 mins call to prove you were not (the whole) problem? Doesn't sound really likely, does it?

Well again - some unit may "believe" it, yet where do you end up then? Correct - with the guys who couldn't produce a single reference because "every single officer and sergeant in their previous unit sucked".

Having a reference, experienced recruiter can tell from a cozy phone call:

- if the person is actually in leadership position in the unit you served (or just a buddy asked to pretend);

- if they have actual knowledge of your performance;

- if there is more to the story and what exactly is this "more".

So the sensible advice - if you want to continue serving in Ukraine, don't make a mess. If thing go downhill don't make everyone in the unit to your enemy. Try to leave on good terms with people, especially UA leadership.

If you still did it the retarded way and "rage quit", accept your unit choice is more limited now. Pick the best option you have, don't repeat the mistakes you made, serve at least a year. Then you're back to normal.

View Poll

Quite surprisingly - in a pleasant way - I have heard of quite a few Polish people interested in joining recently.

26 Artillery brigade has foreign volunteers serving, yet no Polish as of now.

Why we stand out is because we operate Polish AHS Krab.

The whole thing is completely labeled in Polish language, every button and the computer as well.

Our guys were taught/guessed/memorized what each button means as of now, so they operate in confidently.

Yet as a native Polish speaker you would have an advantage mastering the whole thing.

So that you don't get too excited, mind following:

- I do not guarantee we will stay with Krab forever;

- you will still start with the hard job of carrying very 50kg shells - you have to be strong;

- the job is very dangerous;

- all the standard requirements apply to you, I will send them to those interested.

Addressing the elephant in the room - the historic disputes. The unit is no place to settle them. We are all here to do the job. Should you join our unit, I will make sure you are not bugged with any recent or not-so-recent but irrelevant to the mission topics. Same will be expected from you. Polish volunteers are respected and welcome, as are other people, and the unit leadership is here to ensure the cooperation is not obstructed.

So if you want to learn how it feels to operate a Krab which has exhausted it's resource 3 times but is still riding and shooting, let me know!

This one is really psychologically tricky and quite a few foreign volunteers struggle with it. Especially for those without military experience, yet not exclusively.

So there is a guy, let's call him John. John has been gradually developing involvement with Ukraine. He shared the posts about Ukraine, participated in demos, donated to units. At each stage John felt totally appreciated by Ukrainians. Thanks in messages, seeing videos of thanks for delivered aid etc. And now John has come to a point where he decided to take it even further. He will volunteer to fight himself. Feels like pinnacle of loyalty to the cause for him, and it really is in a way. What would a person subcontiously expect for such a move? Total celebration.

And it kind of is at the beginning, but the whole affection evaporates quickly. His shortcoming and occasional mistakes are not played down, rather start getting corrected in increasingly harsh manner. John starts feeling his sacrifice doesn't get the appreciation it deserves. The people he came to help turned out ungrateful.

What John should really understand, preferably even before volunteering, is that once he joins, he is not a fan or a supporter anymore. He is one of us. Same as us.

Ukrainian soldiers don't pat each other on the shoulder for every task done. If they screw up, there are no nice words. It gets nasty, depending on how bad the screw up is.

So here is John sitting in the frontline bunker with his Ukrainian teammates. For him the Everest he reached. For them a newbie to get squared away. A huge abyss between expectations emerges. And it takes serious work on both sides to bridge it. For Ukrainian team, it takes patience and providing adjustment time. The person literally came from another planet, you shouldn't handle him the standard UA military way right away, it will be counterproductive.

For John, it takes understanding, that his arriving to the unit is not the end station. It is just the beginning. And for the whole thing to make sense, he needs to fall in line - the sooner, the better.

Apart from doing the right thing, what were the reasons you came here?

View Poll

Counter-question: I'm going to the US, how much money do I need? Sounds funny, right? The logic is about the same.

The amount of money you need to have UPON ARRIVAL IN UKRAINE depends on many factors, like desired level of comfort and protection, your planned timeline, your supposed role in the army etc.

To make it as straightforward as it goes, I will list your options in ascending budget order:

500 USD: you can theoretically survive with it, given some Foreign Recruiting Centers provide free of charge housing and board, yet highly recommended to stack more.

1000 USD: the bare minimum you definitely need to have with you. Will be enough if you go artillery as very little if any extra gear is realistically needed.

2000-3000 USD enough to buy some extra gear. So reasonable amount if you go drones or non-assault infantry. The upper end of this range is for those planning to attend drone courses.

If you go assault infantry, I won't even speculate cause it really depends on what will be provided by the unit in the first place and what you deem as reasonably sufficient.

Apart from the amount for artillery, these are my estimates, so comments/corrections from infantry or drone operators in Ukraine are welcome.

If you smoke or plan drinking before signing contract, add $$$ accordingly.

Have a least 50%, better more in cash to avoid trouble with bank cards. Well concealed in different parts of your clothing/gear which you have with you at all times. Never tell anyone the real amount you have. Never lend anyone, unless you are totally fine with never having it back.

Lot's of people asking lately - hey, I am talking to a recruiter from XXX brigade, any info on it? Mostly silence. Or very vague "heard the brigade is ok in general" or "heard it sucks".

The thing is - and I can't stress it enough - the Ukrainian Defence Forces are 1 000 000 heavy in personnel. Up to hundred of brigades are taking foreigners. It's like 500 battalions and 1500 companies. Brigade does play a role, yet is ultimately company level leadership which makes your life bearable or not. And you have virtually no chance knowing it before you are there.

Let's take an average Mike. He learnt quickly 3rd AK and Azov are cool. Ah yes, a little digression regarding good units. The thing is, government tends to ruthlessly scale them. Got a good battalion? Hmm we see you can afford to reject candidates. And we, the government, want every warm body we can get. So let's scale a good battalion to brigade. Brigade still popular? We'll make it Army corps then. What happens is a good unit gets hundreds and hundreds vacancies which they must close. And they can only do it fast if they compromise on standards.

So, back to Mike. He applied with the top units, yet didn't hear back or didn't pass the PT. He also learnt about a couple of assault units he should think twice before joining, so he rules them out. Now he is stuck with a giant grey zone of average units he could potentially join and desperately trying to find out if they are "good". Nothing wrong with it per se. Quite understandable from a human point of view.

Yet the reality is that all those units suck, one way or another. Supply sucks. Leadership most likely also sucks - Ukraine just doesn't have enough qualified leaders for a 1 million army. So you are most likely getting "more or less qualified". And the fact no one talks loud about - Mike probably also sucks. Not as a person. He is probably a good one. Yet: PT - more often than not subpar. Military experience - usually none. Commitment horizon - 6 months, maybe a year. Readiness to take risk - limited.

So just make peace with the idea your are jumping in a cesspit, cause you belong there. If you are jumping in a cesspit, does it really matter which one it will be after all?

Some of you reading this might think "hey that's big talk from someone who has it rather comfy now". The big difference is that it's my country, yes. Other than that I did a lot of cesspit swimming myself. Served with as a private in unit where exactly 50% were addicts and exactly 2/3 of vehicles were broken. My mortar battery commander had no idea what mils is. We were a bunch of retards put together by fate. We still did our job. Cause you know what's worse than a retarded unit? None at all. You can't man a 1000 km border with top notch units, it's not realistic.

So it's more or less like betting in a casino. Hey guys, 9 red, is it lucky? What about 12 black? Anyone won? You are betting your life. Best way to stay safe is stay at home. You still coming? So roll the dice and embrace the suck.

P.S. I get this one is controversial. Just my perspective I got after the years. You might disagree with it and it's ok.

https://preview.redd.it/phwwtmrc06ih1.jpg?width=450&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=05a82d15a0f58ab16f71913425aa83184e7ea83c

I will focus on sergeant promotion, as it is realistically the reasonable limit for now. You can be legally put in charge of a platoon as a sergeant. So I guess it will cover 99% of cases. There was an actual case in our battalion - a Ukrainian guy ran platoon fire direction centre for a couple of years. Just chose not to sign the "forever slavery and blank cheque for the Army" officer contract.

To be clear, in this post I mean actual promotions, not "hey we got a sgt vacancy, let's put some foreigner in it, it will make a good PR for us".

So things to consider:

1. Rank follows leadership. If a guy says he needs a rank to lead we now he won't cut it. Rank can add you some weight, yet if there was none to begin with, it won't help. So it needs to start with "let me handle it", "I'll sort it out", "I'll take care of that". Then the unit leadership, provided it's a proper unit, thinks "the guy is actually doing a good job, let's see if we got any sgt vacancies". Mind though, it might take quite some time, maybe a couple of years. Actual case in our battery: there is a talented young guy (Ukrainian). He got into fire direction center. A year passed as he learned stuff and we got confident he is fit for promotion. Then we look at our staffing table - no sgt vacancies. We did find a workaround though - one older guy was in sgt position - a solid man doing manual work, he really couldn't care less about his formal positions. Yet it is a real bureaucratical nightmare to demote someone. Still did it with the older guy's consent and put the young guy in sgt position. He still hasn't got the rank though cause he needs to absolve some courses and nobody has an idea when the courses are available. So the thing doesn't happen overnight.
2. We need a person who gets the job done, not a foreigners' ombudsman/trade union leader. It's okay to stand up for your people, yet there really is time and place for it. Focus on the mission, not making yourself popular.

Now the downsides which come with promotion:

1. Whoever of your subordinates fucks up, YOU get owned for it. Somebody got drunk? You take the blame. Lost something valuable? You didn't see it's safe. Posted dumb shit on social media? You must sort it out. Vehicle got damaged because of someone's on your team negligence? It's your fault. And yes you can legally have the damage amount deducted from your salary. It doesn't happen often, but it's possible.
2. You have little to no control of who is on your team and virtually no leverage to discipline them - at least at the start. The first year or so suck. You never chose the retard to be on your team in the first place? Well bring another guy in then. You can't? So work with the one you have then. Want to formally write him up? Unit doesn't want paperwork and bad statistics, so you are expected to "just talk to him". So what actually happens is the new sgt does quite some stuff himself at first. After the unit leadership gets confident the guy can handle it, he gets the license to kill. Like comes to unit leadership and says: "look I've been running this bunch of retards for six months. There's never been an issue of which you got to know, because I cleaned up all the mess. All in all they are tolerable, yet there is one douchebag is no use and is ruining it. I want him gone". Ooops - the guy is gone (reassigned or terminated contract). Everyone knows why and everyone knows who wanted it. New sheriff in town. It gets easier after that point.

Directly asking to remove someone is only advisable if you have 100% confidence in your higher-ups. You've got to be sure they will do it or at least handle the question discretely, which is by far not always the case, especially if the guy in question is a well-entrenched arsehole. You can drop some hints like "hmm I see you put X on my team for this mission. Can I rather have Y or no one at all?". That's it. The ball is theirs. You can see if they really have your 6.

All in all it's a long game and a lot of extra effort. Think if it's worth it.

There is a HUGE shortage of drivers in the AFU. So some guys think "hey, I can do that". Nothing wrong with that, yet let's see why it is more complicated than it seems.

First, there are two sorts of driver vacancies: combat vehicle driver and supply vehicle driver.

Combat vehicle driver requirements (for most units, in descending priority):

1. You need solid technical skills. Ukraine doesn't have the luxury to require exact match in your experience, yet having similar background (i.e. tracked or wheeled) in your home military is strongly recommended. Your crew wants to be sure you can get the damn thing started and take them out when shit goes down. They won't take "I'm driver only, not a mechanic". Absolutely not.
2. Although some units can close one eye at your fitness test for experienced candidates, you still need to be able and willing to pull together with the crew. You drive a tank? You load ammo together. Howitzer? Same. Crews don't take princess-drivers well.
3. You should be able to memorize the routs. How do you infil? How do you exfil? You should either be very good with maps and memorizing, or have language skills, or both.

Supply vehicle

1. Awesome navigation skills - you will be expected to remember like a dozen locations and how to get to them without hints.
2. Language skills. Driver gets many different tasks and request. "Take a case of ammo from Serhiy at X location and hand it over to Mykola at Y location", "Hey Mike, here's Sasha, could you buy me a block of cigs and energy drinks"?. You are also expected to memorize people.
3. Technical skills - you are still expected to do basic maintenance of the vehicle.

So it's not just driving. It's much more than that.

https://preview.redd.it/umfpot02f0ih1.jpg?width=690&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ec3f13c39ebc3d3a03ed0015bd6e2b90a155773a

1. Как добраться?

Через Молдову. У перечисленных стран безвиз с Молдовой и Украиной. Каждый кандидат планирует и оплачивает дорогу самостоятельно.

Молдова находится под частичным влиянием российских спецслужб, поэтому не исключены затруднения, однако это самый реальный вариант если у вас не Шенгенской визы. После прибытия на территорию Украины вам необходимо явиться в один из рекрутинговых центров для иностранцев (Львов или Тернополь).

2. Примут ли меня в ВСУ?

Если у вас нет серьезных проблем со здоровьем;

Если у вас нет алкогольной и/или наркотической зависимости;

Вы ведете себя и общаетесь адекватно;

Владеете русским (и/или английским) на среднем уровне;

Не являетесь агентом вражеских разведывательных служб (подлежит проверке СБУ);

Готовы служить на боевых должностях, прежде всего в пехоте;

- проблем не возникнет.

3. Каково денежное довольствие?

После недавнего повышения военнослужащим уже начислено на карты:

- нахождение и оборона в полосе взводных опорных пунктов (условный 0, то есть передний край) 270 000 грн, т.е. 6 000 долларов по текущему курсу;

- нахождение и оборона в полосе ротных опорных пунктов (линия обороны за нулем) 170 000 грн, т.е. 4 000 долларов по текущему курсу;

предусмотрены дополнительные бонусы за участие в штурмах, взятие в плен и ликвидацию противника.

4. Каково обучение?

Все без исключения военнослужащие проходят минимум 51 день обучения перед отправкой на фронт.

5. Что брать с собой в дорогу

По минимуму. Ничего военного. Гражданская одежда, включая зимнюю. Лекарства, если принимаете какие-либо рецептурные.

6. На что я и моя семья может рассчитывать в случае ранения или гибели?

В случае ранения и лечения в военном госпитале сохраняется ежемесячная выплата 100 000 грн т.е. приблизительно 2200 долларов в течение не более чем 12 месяцев.

В случае установления военно-врачебной комиссией инвалидности в следствие выполнения боевой задачи, в зависимости от группы инвалидности: 1 группа 1 330 000 грн (28 000 долларов), 2 группа 1 000 000 грн (22 000 долларов), 3 группа 830 000 грн (18 000 долларов). Обстоятельства получения травмы подлежат расследованию. То есть если инвалидность настала вследствие самовредительства, алкогольного/наркотического опьянения, грубой халатности и т.п. выплата не осуществляется.

В случае гибели выплата родственникам составляет 15 000 000 грн (330 000 долларов). Для получения выплаты родственникам необходимо прибыть в Украину, открыть счет в украинском банке и предоставить документы подтверждающие ближайшее родство. Аналогично, проводится расследование. Если устанавливается факт самострела, опьянения и т.п. в выплате будет отказано. Выплата по факту гибели производиться в случае наличия тела или останков пригодных для взятия ДНК.

В случае пропажи без вести, военнослужащий может быть обьявленный погибшим по решению суда не ранее чем через 6 месяцев.

7. Что будет происходить после того как я прибуду в рекрутинговый центр?

На вас заведут личное дело, вы пройдете врачебную комиссию, вам будет присвоенный украинский налоговый номер и выпущена банковская карточка. Паралельно будет проводиться миграционная и контрразведывательная проверка. Все в месте занимает несколько недель. В ходе этого процесса рекрутеры подразделений будут ознакомлены с вашей кандидатурой и свяжутся с вами на предмет прохождения службы в их подразделении.

8. Имею ли я право на отпуск?

Да, аналогично с украинскими военнослужащими, вы имеете право на 30-ти дневный отпуск. Основная часть по закону должна быть "отгуляна" в обязательном порядке и составляет 15 дней. Остальные 15 могут быть взяты как сразу так и по частям, по согласованию с командованием. Предоставляются дополнительные дни на дорогу. Выезд в отпуск за пределы Украины согласовывается с командованием и отмечается в отпускном билете.

9. Какова длительность контракта?

Пехотно-штурмовой контракт 10 месяцев.

10. Дает ли служба основания для ПМЖ или гражданства Украины?

Служба в Силах обороны Украины дает основания для законного пребывания на территории страны на протяжении контракта и в течении 6 месяцев после его завершения - при условии увольнения по окончанию действия контракта (если с контракта "вылетели" из-за СОЧ или несоответствия, 6 месяцев не дается).

Служба в Силах обороны также дает основания для упрощенного получения гражданства.

So the new increased compensation has already arrived to soldiers' bank cards. The confirmed monthly amounts which have actually arrived to the soldiers were 270 000 UAH - appr 6000 USD (zero line) and 170 000 UAH - appr 4000 USD (immediately behind zero). As per my info from fellow infantry unit, the new pay is applied to all infantry regardless when you signed contract.

The new bonus system is following:

Base pay - 30 000 UAH (550 USD) - when in training or in the rear

When deployed:

1. Combat action bonus: 100 000 UAH (2200 USD)

+

2. Frontline deployment bonus

-deployment at zero line - no friendly troops in front of you, just enemy

170 000 UAH (3800 USD) monthly, accrued proportionally to days spent, that is per day you get 120 USD

-deployment at first line (immediately behind zero line)

70 000 UAH (1500 USD) monthly, accrued proportionally to days spent, that is per day you get 50 USD

2. daily assault bonus. For assault operations only:

20 000 UAH (450 USD) - recapturing lost positions in Ukrainian defence line

40 000 UAH (900 USD) - capturing Russian positions

These are tough for the brigade to have confirmed with higher command, so delays and failures to be expected.

+

3. for enemies killed or taken prisoner

killed - 15 000 UAH (300 USD)

taken prisoner - 100 000 UAH (2200 USD) - to be divided between all soldiers who directly took part in taking prisoner

Killed in action and taken prisoners with video verification only (you need a gopro camera or someone filming the immediate process with a phone).

The total monthly compensation is capped at 460 000 UAH (approximately 10 000 USD)

It was all pretty much straightforward before this "reform".

Your green book was your certificate. Got discharged? You have some time to leave country, unless you have other legal grounds to stay.

Yet as the government has it, the matter had to be "simplified".

That means you now need to have a separate document just like any other foreigner in Ukraine.

So

1. Who's headache is it to get the Permanent Residency Certificate (PRC)?

According to the law, it is your personal responsibility to have it done.

Common sense has it your unit is better equipped to do it centrally for all internationals though.

2. What happens if your unit screws up to have it done?

Technically you only have 3 months legal stay on a normal visa-free arrangement. After that 3 months are up and you still don't have the certificate, magic happens: you are both illegally in Ukraine (no certificate) and cannot legally leave (you are on contract). Yes, it's Ukraine.

It's not that (very) bad as it sounds though. Inside Ukraine you are unlikely to have any problems.

The interesting part starts if you want to go on holiday abroad. The border guard looks at the date you crossed border into Ukraine. Adds three months. Understands it's long past. Asks you: do you have PRC? You say no. He says: so you've been here illegally. You loose it and shout: "no, for fucks sake, I've been fighting for this country and it's not my fault your bureaucracy is so retarded!" The border guard looks at the red rubber stamp "Entry to Ukraine denied till...". Will he smash it into your passport? Who knows. While police would most often say "alright, call your commander", border guards are assholes more often than not.

So it's up to you really. If you want to go on holiday and be sure to return, start bugging your unit early to get PRC done. If you had enough and just want to leave without comming back, than you can just ignore the whole thing.

3. Ok, suppose I have the PRC. I dissolve contract. Do I have time to stay legally in Ukraine?

To put simply, if your contract is dissolved upon maturity (3 years) or upon your wish, but officially (!) you get 6 months to stay.

If you are discharged for misconduct, AWOL or anything like that you don't have 6 months.

4. When is the deadline?

The law was signed on December 17th, 2025. Comes into effect in 3 moths after signature - March 17th, 2026. 6 months are given after it comes into effect - that is deadline is September, 17th, 2026.

Source: https://zakon.rada.gov.ua/laws/show/4730-20#Text

Every foreigner seeking advice on coming to serve in the Armed Forces of Ukraine heard it.

The local street-smart. "They want to have you killed in infantry bro. Be smart bro. Just go drones".

You technically savvy? No? Doesn't matter. Just go drones is auto respond.

I am not infantry myself and am therefore in no position to judge people who choose not to do it.

What I can tell you, is that the universal wisdom got picked up by most.

Guess what happens next?

Something the drone echo chamber didn't think of.

The drone guys get a knock on their blindage door. Enemy.

How come?

Don't we have infantry in the front to protect us?

No, pal, you most probably don't. Everybody's smart now. Everybody goes drones.

My brother lost his whole drone crew this way. They believed they have infantry in front of them. They didn't.

So now if you go drones, at least FPV, you are BOTH drones AND infantry.

Just so that you know, when you see the promo of high-tech drone forces.

Like just think about it.

Absolutely no women in sight for months. Fresh air. Guns. Lots of men. Big armored vehicles. Just cause. Shooting live ammunition at real enemies. Danger.

Ah yes, danger... Unfortunately comes with a downside one might get killed or injured.

Duration. No fortnight packages. 6 months minimum, 1 year for best result.

The best part - you only need to pay for your travel and you even get paid for serving here!

For those into Alpha thing, a True Alpha certificate will be issued upon honorable discharge. But remember - no Alpha stuff while here, you only become one after you finish the course.

If you're into humiliation, extra humiliation can be provided upon request.

The US folks would casually mention "I am a vet myself and...". As far as I can tell, everyone who served is called veteran.

It is quite different in Ukraine. Historically, only WW2 vets were called veterans. Absolutely not for military service in peacetime and even not for other deployments. Leaving the interpretations of WW2 and Soviet Union out, this particular war was the only one considered defensive, totally just, extremely long and hard, therefore giving it's participants unique right to be named veterans. Participants of all others wars and operations were called just that, participants, or afghanis (for Afghan war).

WW2 vets were something like Japanese Emperors in their families. Semi-religious figures.

That's why you would almost never hear a Ukrainian call themselves veterans. Every one of us has this kid inside looking up to his grandfather with a chestfull of medals not even having the idea of ever become anywhere equal to him. Many of us are longer in than WW2 lasted. Many have lost limbs. Many have their own boxes of decorations.

Yet still deep down we ask ourselves this question - am I really worthy to ascend the throne of my grandfather?