u/janebenn333

A few days ago I posted about my elderly mother's (87) tendency to use the word "we" whenever she needs or wants something done around the house. And it seems like a lot of people experience the same issue with their aging parents.

So yesterday she did it again. She said that "we" need to move an appliance from where it is to another spot. And this was at the end of a very long day when I had spent hours on cleaning and gardening. So I said to her that "we" aren't going to move it today, I'll do it another day.

She looked at me and said "I know you don't like me using the word 'we' and you want me to say 'you' but I don't say that because I don't want to sound like I'm ordering you around."

I replied to her that it doesn't matter if she uses the word "we" to feel better about it, in the end it's "me" who has to do it so, what's the difference? She said that if she could do it she would, but she can't. And left it at that.

And it hit me. My mother is a covert/vulnerable narcissist. She has many chronic health conditions and has made her illnesses a central part of her personality as well as a reason that she should receive special treatment.

(For example, we had a huge argument last week that she should be receiving disability benefits but she doesn't fit the definition of someone with a disability; she's just old. She didn't like that.)

And before anyone thinks "yeah but she's sick", she worked all her life, right up until she was 60 years old. She has come through multiple surgeries. She has lived, at this point, 7 years longer than any of her siblings, her parents died in their 50s and 60s, and she outlived my father who was the same age as her. In fact I can count on one hand the number of her close relatives who are still living and made it past 80. So while she is indeed elderly and in delicate health, my entire life, starting when I was maybe 10 or 11, she has made me her caretaker rather than accept help from anyone else.

And yet, I don't think I've ever heard her say to someone, ever, that she is grateful for what I do because to her, it's a sign of weakness that she can't do it herself. So when she is using the word "we", I think she truly views me as an extension of herself.

And so to use a simple request like: "when you have a minute, can you please move this thing to the cupboard for me?" seems almost impossible for her. Because to her, I am her arms, her legs, her eyes so why would she ask me to please do something for her?

Anyway, no advice needed. Just something I'm working through because I'm trying to learn through all of this how *not* to behave with my own adult children as I age.

I moved in with my 87 yo covert-narc mother 3 years ago after my father died as she can not live alone. I've since retired and one of the things I've done as a way to pass time is to learn how to tend to my late father's lawn and garden. It's very large, flower beds, vegetable gardens etc. And learning about the plants and the trees and even experimenting with growing vegetables has given me something new to learn and do.

A few days ago I was trying to diagnose and deal with a large perennial plant that looks like it has some kind of damage from this horrible winter. I researched how to handle it online and started to trim away damaged leaves and based on what I read it just needs some time and it should recover.

Well my mother comes out as I'm doing this and said that now that I've trimmed the plant it "looks ugly" and that I should cut away healthy leaves because it "doesn't look even". I explained why I did what I did and why I shouldn't cut the healthy parts but she didn't care. "Well it looks awful, I don't like it. I think I'll just rip it out." Even when I said that all it needs was some time and it will look better, she kept saying "it looks ugly, I don't like it, rip it out."

I finally said to her "So wait, if I get sick or injured and a foot needs to come off as treatment, you going to suddenly kick me out?". She said "No, don't be stupid. But this plant is for beauty and decoration and if it no longer looks good I don't want it." I replied that as a plant it will recover, and it needs care and time. "I don't care and I don't want to look at it."

Well, I refused to rip it out and it would be hard to do anyway, it's been in that yard for probably over 15 years. She got upset that I never listen to her and stomped inside.

And I thought, well, she just summed up the biggest part of her personality: everything needs to look perfect and if it doesn't she just gives up on it. She doesn't want it. She critiques anything and everyone that isn't esthetically pleasing to her. Even at her age the outside of her house is incredibly important to her. The grass, the flowers, the porch...everything.

I get it. I totally get it. My elderly 86 year old mother no longer has the strength or stamina to do what she used to do in her house or her garden.

And I completely understand that the only reason she is able to "age in place" in the house she and my late father lived in for decades is because I live with her and agreed to take care of things.

But everything that happens in this house starts with a "we". Just a collection of the things that "we" are doing in the near/immediate future. This is not a complete list.

• "We" have to touch up the paint on her outdoor balcony because she doesn't like the colour.
• "We" have to rip the grass out of the flower bed in the backyard because it looks bad.
• "We" have to pull out the extra wild plants all over the yard because, again, it looks messy and awful (her words).
• "We" have to wash the rug next to the back door.
• "We" have to mop the basement floor.
• "We" have to trim the yucca plant because there are diseased leaves and it will spread.
• "We" have to wash the windows and call the guy to clean the gutters.

Just in case you're wondering "we" is "me" because my mother can't do any of this stuff. She says she used to do all these things and now it's all out of control because she's not doing it anymore. (Although at one point she let it slip that she had to beg my father to remove grass from her flower beds.) And tonight she literally whined for a good half hour about how all these things are vitally important and must be done asap.

This is on top of, by the way, daily meals, grocery shopping, laundry, housekeeping.

So I said to her that I would do these things but I would do them at my own pace. That I can't do it all now, as she insists. She started to complain about this statement for another half hour about how "we" have to do these things because the house and garden look "abandoned".

No. No they don't.

So here's my issue with how this is all being framed, aside from the fact that I'm being asked to take on a ton of work in a short period of time. My issue is that she has, in effect, decided that I am an extension of her and these responsibilities transfer by default to me. No question about whether I have other plans for my days or if I'm tired or if I am capable of these things. "We" just have to get it done.

And when it's "we", this makes it look like I'm getting some help. I'm not. In fact, today while I was planting the vegetable garden and flowers, she was outside a total of 20 minutes, telling me what I was doing wrong, pointing out all I haven't gotten done yet and then went back inside as makes sense for her health and condition.

Anyway I'm just venting. I know I can always say "no" but when I do I get harangued and harassed about how these were all things she did "all the time" and I should be able to do them too essentially shaming more for not being good enough.... yeah, whatever.

Making it over 60 is a privilege. Women who live to 65 in Canada, should expect to live to about age 85 or so.

As we live longer, we also pile on the losses and problems around us and I for one go through periods of very high anxiety and worry. Not for myself but for my family members. I have a younger sister, who is in her 50s, who has many health issues and I worry about her constantly. With good reason, she's had a number of medical emergencies and I worry about her all the time.

I have a son who is 30 who has a few health issues of his own. He was in ER last week for a fast heart rate. This happens to him once a year or so. He's a very anxious young man and just this week learned one of his childhood friends had passed. I worry about him all the time.

I have a daughter who lives on the other side of the country and is moving to Europe shortly. I worry about her all the time.

I care for an elderly mother. She is 87, she has multiple health issues. II don't leave her alone for more than a couple of hours. I worry about her all the time.

I tell myself everything will be okay but I'm old enough to know it's not always okay. And while I've been through a lot in my life, each new loss and problem is harder and harder to handle. And I always seem to be waiting for the other shoe to drop.

How do you manage worry ladies?

Edited: Wow, thank you everyone for firstly, helping me see that I'm not alone and that others deal with this issue, secondly, providing me with strategies for coping and managing my anxiety and finally, providing a perspective of how to live with less worry. So many methods to help and I thank you all.

If people have experience with this, I would appreciate some tips.

I live with my elderly 86, soon to be 87, year old mother. She has many health issues the biggest of which is her heart. She has a prosthetic valve that's been replaced twice and a pacemaker. She takes about 20 pills a day to control her underlying problems.

At her age and situation, her cardiologist and electrophysiologists want to see her every six months. Their offices are located in the centre of the city, usually about an hour drive away.

Over the past year or two she has become increasingly reluctant to attend these appointments. She says the drive makes her tired, being away from home so long is difficult, and she says she finds the visits "pointless" because they just give her a lot of information, tell her to keep going and then there's nothing further for them to do.

This week her appointment includes a full echo-cardiogram (which she gets once a year) and she finds them exhausting and difficult because she has arthritis and they require her to move around and shift positions. I find it depends which technician she gets; some are more gentle.

When we've tried to combine all the appointments so the travel is minimized, she protests because it's "too much in one day and I get tired." If I suggest that maybe she ask to have the frequency of visits changed to once a year instead of twice, she gets angry and says "But I can't just abandon my care, if that's how often they need to see me, then I should go." She has an impression that if she reduces the visits they'll "drop her" which is so not true.

This doesn't stop her from becoming anxious and nervous each and every time. I will hear "I don't think I'll be able to go" all week and then the day before there will be a panic. "I don't feel well enough to go." I heard her up and about last night, she couldn't sleep. She's had issues sleeping for the past few days and I know it's anxiety. She eventually took a lorazepam to calm herself.

I reassure her and say, she'll be okay, but we can always cancel and rebook if she feels unwell. I can only think of one time that we actually cancelled because she was recovering from a procedure and just wasn't up to it.

Does anyone else experience this and how do you deal with it?

My mother is 87 and I live with her as her primary caregiver. I am 61 and I am currently retired.

I swear not a single day goes by without my mother yelling at me, arguing, upset, angry about something whether it is about me, something I did, something I didn't do, her body, life, the world, her iPad, the POTUS, the PM of Canada, the PM of Italy, our local politicians, her neighbours, or whatever she just saw on Facebook or on the news.

It is exhausting.

This morning she saw an ad on Facebook by a service that helps people get a Disability Tax Credit (we are in Canada), for a fee of course. This triggered a storm of anger, mostly aimed at me, because apparently I didn't know about this credit and she had to pay a small bit of income tax and she shouldn't have to pay anything. Everything is unfair and "they're all crooks" and "they're stealing money from people". I looked up the process for this credit and she became angry about the process. I described the criteria, which she doesn't meet, and she got even angrier "Now I'm not disabled!!!".

People talk about "grey rocking", just not reacting when someone becomes overly angry and agitated so that you can de-escalate and cool down the emotions. But how do I endure HOURS of insults and anger hurled at me. I've even tried saying things like "I don't want to talk about this anymore" and she will typically respond: "Now I can't talk about things in my own house".

I think she craves the "rush" or the "high" of being angry.

I've lost 30 lbs and I feel great about that. The scale is important to monitor the progress and impact of what I am doing but the off-scale stuff is just as important to me.

I've been putting off buying new clothes because I didn't want to spend money when I'm still not at goal. But I just was no longer comfortable in the clothes I was wearing when I was heavier. The pants were falling down, the tops just hanging shapelessly off me.

So I went to the mall to, initially, look for new jeans but couldn't find anything I liked so I on a whim I walked into the Lululemon. I saw a sales associate and asked if there were any casual pants or bottoms in my size. She handed me their largest size of two different styles and...they both fit!!!!

I think so many people here will understand my happiness at being able to wear clothes that are NOT from a plus size section! I even went to another store (Roots) and bought t-shirts that were not "XL". I could wear an "L"!

Now, we all know that sizing isn't consistent and walking into another store, the largest size couldn't barely get past my hips BUT I'm going to take my victories where I can. I went through my closet and brought some of my smaller sizes forward and put the bigger sizes in the back of the closet.

*Yay*

I live with my 87 year old widowed mum. She's not in the best shape; she has heart problems, osteoarthritis, blood pressure issues, she takes 20 pills a day. But most days she's well enough to get up and around on her own.

How I know it's going to be a bad day: I get up earlier than her to have some moments of peace to myself and on days like today I hear her calling me from her room. That's always a bad sign.

Go over to find her standing but holding on to the wall as she was attempting to come get some pain relievers. Her first words "What am I going to do? My back hurts so much."

I sat her back down on her bed, went to get her two Tylenol (all she can take with her conditions and meds) and a small container of yogurt so she's not taking it on an empty stomach. She described where everything hurt and it sounds like her inflammatory rheumatoid arthritis is flaring up. I can see her wrists are swollen and when I touched her back, that is swelling too.

"What am I going to do? I haven't gone to the bathroom in days (she's constipated) and if I don't move around it will be worse. But I'm in too much pain." So I tried to settle her down and got her morning meds and suggested she rest until the pain feels better. She did a quick trip to the bathroom and has now gone back to bed.

This has become my life with my mum. Trying to comfort her and listen. I don't offer suggestions anymore because I find they just frustrate her. Instead I listen and I just go through her normal routine. I've been so down lately; for a lot of reasons too long to list here. It's hard to be positive but I need to be in order to help her.

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This is driving me bananas. It's just my perfectionist nature perhaps. But since I got this coin it's skewed in the card. I don't want to open the card to straighten it but I'm wondering if there's a way to rotate this without opening it up? I've tried shaking it but it doesn't work. Anyone have ideas? If I can't then I'm going to leave it alone.

My elderly mother (87) gets government funded assistance for an hour 3 times a week to get a shower. Her doctors requested it when my mother started to experience instability and dizziness. It's safer for her to have help showering. Except for a brief time during COVID when she paused the service she has used it for the past decade.

The issue is that she tires of the workers quickly. She'll like them initially and then slowly, surely the complaints begin. Complaints about tardiness or laziness or something about their personality. Lately she's been super critical of her latest helper who she's had for about 18 months. She's too rough, doesn't clean enough, is too nosy and presumptuous. I've met her and the woman is competent and friendly but my mom's had enough lol

So I asked her today if she wanted to request a new person and so far she's said no but if the pattern holds there will be a big argument and she'll change her mind.

Sometimes I wonder if its just boredom. Or an extension of her negative outlook.

One thing I'm learning about myself is that I have a tendency to feel it's my role to "rescue" or "save" or "help" everyone. I feel like it's more than just being supportive or helpful; it's at often times bordered on being intrusive and no one benefits, least of all me.

For example, I have two adult children in their 30s and it is *extremely hard* to not just jump in and start to do things or plan things or provide advice even when I haven't been asked to. I always have this sense of what can go wrong and that served me extremely well in my career and professional life (organizations like planners who anticipate issues) but in my personal life it hasn't always worked.

My ex-husband needed to be rescued all the time. He frequently lost his job, made poor business and investment decisions and even poor personal choices facing legal problems. Eventually I just completely cut him off from any support and we separated because I couldn't handle it. First, he was a loser and secondly no matter what I did, it didn't work and I took on the responsibility and guilt for all his fuck-ups.

But my kids, they are full grown smart, intelligent, brave adults. And yet, I am always seeing potential problems and disasters around the corner and feel that if I am not pointing these things out I am being a bad parent. I know, intellectually, that this comes from being raised by a narc-mother. And especially one who parentified me at a very early age and held me to almost impossible standards.

To this day, she is 87, she will anticipate catastrophe because other people do not know how to function properly (in her opinion) and because I'm exposed to her day in and day out she triggers that response in me to get ahead of things and fix them. Because I don't want her freaking out and of course holding me responsible.

I've heard more than once: "I know your kids are adults but you are their parent and it's your job to counsel them." This is exactly what drove me to never confide in her or tell her anything because I knew she'd swoop in and take over. I do not want to be that way with my kids. But on the other hand, I don't want to appear disinterested or uncaring. Because I never got any support as an adult.

I need an RBN mantra: "Universe, help me have faith and trust in the people around me and release me from this need to manage everything. And teach me to not provide advice or help unless I'm asked to."

Anyone successfully beat this back?

I am 61, going on 62. I am separated from my husband and I am retired for the past year, living with my elderly (87) widowed mother.

My greatest source of joy and pride are my adult children. My son (30) lives in the city where I live but he lives a distance away (I'm on the outskirts and he is downtown), works full time, lives on his own and is soon starting a part time graduate program. So he's a busy man to say the least. We see each other in person probably once a month but speak weekly. He is someone I enjoy being with; a very intelligent thoughtful man and we have a lot in common.

My daughter (34) has lived in another part of the country for three years. She moved to the Atlantic provinces (we are in Canada) for a job and this is her third year there. She visits me at Christmas and typically spends a few weeks with me during the summer as she is an educator and has the summer off. She is also someone who brings me so much happiness and joy. She is funny and smart and full of ideas and light.

She's in the process of applying for a job in Europe. It will be for a year to start with the potential for more and should she be offered it she will take it. She has said she wanted to return home and was looking for a job in our city but this one turned up and she couldn't pass up the opportunity. She's single and she sees this as an adventure.

I am of course supporting her decision to do whatever she chooses but my God my heart breaks for how much I will miss her. She's lived away from me for years so I've become accustomed to not having her here but now it will be a cross-Atlantic flight and a 6 hour time difference and I'm just going to miss her so much.

Fellow moms... am I alone in feeling sad about not being able to see my adult kids who I love so much? I know I can travel too but I do have an elderly mother who demands a lot of my time so it's not that easy if you know what I mean. Gosh it's hard having kids far away.

I've been a fan of Jane Austen's books since 1995 and "back in the day" there was a lively, extremely active online community called The Republic of Pemberley. Today I was rummaging through some drawers and found this tote bag that I ordered from them back in the early 2000's. It has rarely been used but it survived a few moves and many cullings of closets and drawers since then. I've taken the tote bag out and I'm going to use it. Why the heck not?

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Conversation with my 87 year old covert narc-mother this morning.

• Mom: "I haven't heard from Sue [our neighbour] at all. I wonder if they went away for the weekend?"
• Me: "No. They were home. Sue called me a few times this weekend."
• Mom: "Oh! I never see their lights on in their house so I thought they were away." [mother can see pretty much into Sue's house from her side windows]
• Me: "I guess they have really good blinds because they were home."
• Mom: "So what are they doing closing their blinds when they are home?"
• Me: "Maybe so that people aren't looking into their house all the time. Like you do."
• Mom: "I'm not purposely looking into their house! I just want to know they are okay."
• Me: "Well, they are ok. They were home all weekend."
• Mom: "Then they must be in their basement a lot because usually I can see if they are in their kitchen or watching TV."
• Me: "Not with their blinds closed you can't."
• Mom: "I'm not spying on them! I just check to see if their lights are on and if they are home to make sure they are okay. And why do they need those blinds and that huge fence? The only person who can see into their house is me. They have all these cameras and stuff to protect themselves from who? Me? I'm the only one who can see."
• Me: "You close your blinds at night. You have a door camera."
• Mom: "That's different!"
• Me: "Anyway, they are okay, Sue called me a few times this weekend. They weren't away. If you want to check on her, give her a call."
• Mom: "No! I'm not calling her! If she's so worried about me looking into her house that she closes her blinds then I don't want to talk to her."

I had to control myself from laughing my head off. If you are of a certain age, there's this hilarious English comedy called "Keeping Up Appearances" and there's a character called Hyacinth who spies on everyone. That's my mum.