r/Neurofeedback

If someone is doing neurofeedback or qEEG-guided work, would a brain PBM device be useful as a complementary tool, or is it better to keep those things separate?

The two seem complementary rather than redundant, PBM warms the brain up before a neurofeedback session, giving it more energy to work with so the training sticks better. Some practitioners are even using the qEEG data to guide both at the same time, targeting the same areas instead of doing them blind.
I understood that irradiance matters more than total power because it tells you what's being delivered, while total power can look bigger just from stacking more LEDs. I guess that logic hold for transcranial use? And is programmability worth prioritizing or is that more of a clinical thing?

Would it be correct to assume that the precision of zscore training is related to the same device that is used for the qeegs themselves?

For example, if the qeeg would show abnormal deviations in comparison to a database, this same equipment would try to normilize those same deviations when doing zscore training?

Feeling anxious about how to begin as I have never used a tdcs machine before.

Am aware of the smile montage but wondered if there are any other montages that could help me with what i am experiencing.

Have tried talk therapy, meds and psychedelics and am hoping for some relief with tdcs. Dont want to overdo it and fry my brain!

Welcome advice on best montages to use, best time of day and how often and links to resources, montages, protocols and expecially videos explaining how best to utilise the device.

Also wondering if i can use the device for vagus nerve stimulation?

Thanks

Anyone have low coherence

I've been lurking in this sub for a while and finally just asking because I'm going in circles. I have anxiety and some GI issues my doctor thinks are vagal tone related and he suggested trying at-home vagus nerve stimulation.

But the more I research the more skeptical I get.. How is a Pulsetto worth $300+ when you can buy a TENS unit with an ear clip on Amazon for like $40? Is it just the app? Because the stimulation mechanism seems identical to me.

And then the vibration ones like Apollo Neuro and Sensate.. do those actually stimulate the vagus nerve or do they just vibrate and calm you down?? Because those feel like two very different things.

Has anyone here tried more than one type and noticed a real difference? or better yet measured your HRV, digestion, sleep quality, etc?

Also has anyone just done a DIY TENS ear clip setup and gotten comparable results to the $300 branded devices? Because if so I feel like a lot of people are getting ripped off and nobody wants to say it.

Thanks in advance!

I’m looking into neurofeedback for ADHD/burnout symptoms, but the lack of standardization is frustrating. Every center I call gives the same vague “rewiring the brain” explanation, but when I ask about their assessment process or protocols, the answers get fuzzy.

Some places do a full 19-channel qEEG map before starting. Others just put a few sensors on during the first visit and call that an assessment. Pricing is also all over the place, and a lot of clinics push big 20-30 session packages before I even understand what they’re measuring.

For people who have done neurofeedback, how did you screen providers?

Did you look for qEEG?
Did they explain why they chose a protocol?
Did they track raw data or progress in a way you could understand?
Did they charge per session or only sell packages?

I’m not against trying it. I just want to avoid paying wellness-spa prices for something that isn’t very individualized.

Hello everyone,

I have been doing neurofeedback for a few months now. And so far, I have seen almost no results.

I suffer from digestive issues—specifically an intolerance—to which my entire system reacts. Whenever I consume something I react to—whether it be food or supplements—I respond with exhaustion, anxiety, restlessness, racing thoughts, Difficulty falling asleep and sleep disorders. I felt unwell for the entire last year because I was taking copper glycinate and reacted to the minimal dose of glycine contained within it.

Since discontinuing that supplement, I have felt the effects of neurofeedback for the very first time. I experienced a meditative state; I felt a sensation of warmth and noticed improved blood circulation in my arms and legs. During the entire period that I was taking copper glycinate, I reacted so strongly to the glycine that I couldn't even meditate; I simply couldn't settle down. Now, after stopping it, it works.

I experience the same reaction with Omega-3 and astaxanthin, as they interfere with acetylcholine metabolism.

The same thing happens to me with L-glutamine, because in my system, it gets converted into glutamate.

I also experience this reaction when I take 400 mg of B2 (I tried it as a test to treat my migraines).

When I eat nothing but rice and chicken, I feel great; unfortunately, however, that is not a permanent solution, and it doesn't solve any of my underlying problems in the long run.

Another one of my major issues is an extreme copper deficiency; my copper levels won't rise—either due to insufficient stomach acid or because of my SIBO—both of which hinder my absorption. Perhaps I wouldn't react so sensitively to supplements if I didn't have this massive copper deficiency. I can easily imagine that the issues within my psyche are the overarching reason why my system is so broken. Theoretically, this could almost be resolved through NFB; however, in practice, my physical ailments are hindering the NFB process.

I have already undergone a qEEG twice, and while the results show positive changes, there have been no noticeable subjective improvements.

Was the training process all for nothing?

Should I get a new qEEG done now that my mind is for the first time in a "neutral" state?

Given my medical conditions, is my current psychological state perhaps actually appropriate—meaning that, through NFB, I have manipulated a natural reaction into an unnatural one?

Does anyone have any advice for me?

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TL,DR: some say alpha theta can be dangerous or destabilizing until I develop a sense of safety and regulation through other NFT, but another suggests I go straight to alpha theta since other protocols haven't been helpful.

Hello! I've been pursuing neurofeedback primarily to reduce constant rumination and to calm my nervous system (I have formally diagnosed treatment resistant MDD, GAD ADHD, OCD, and several therapists have informally diagnosed cPTSD).

I've done about 30 sessions - initially ISF (which did nothing), and then SMR (which has worsened symptoms). This practitioner thinks I should do at least 10 more sessions of SMR, and states that alpha theta is dangerous and destabilizing if my nervous system is not regulated. I'm feeling hesitant to do any more SMR because it is worsening my rumination, SH, and SI dangerously, but I've read many other practitioners who also suggest alpha theta can be dangerous and destabilizing without previous success calming the nervous system with other protocols.

Another practitioner reviewed my qeeg, and has suggested I go straight to alpha theta training.

Are there other "safer" options than alpha theta? Protocols that aren't risky that are strictly for calming dysregulation, other than ISF or SMR?

Hello,

I had my first neurofeedback session today. My dr didn't do a qeeg, she just relied on the symptoms I told her and her observations from previous talk sessions. For the past 13 years I've been on ssris. First I was on 10mg Lexapro. 2 years ago it stopped working for me so I got put on 20mg prozac (I am currently on 20mg prozac). I have a highly sensitive nervous system and my observer mode is always on. So im basically living life through mental representations of myself and just watching myself go through life. All my attention is turned inwards. Im hypervigilant of my thoughts and I seem to be just "fusing" with my thoughts. So whatever my brain things is my "current state" I become that. Because of this, I have high anxiety and depression, poor concentration, impulsivness, etc there seems to be no separation between thoughts and action, I just fuse immediately with the thoughts and it's really destabilizing me. Also I seem to lack agency in a sense that i feel like my actions/thoughts/feelings dont come from me which is a terrible feeling because it makes me constantly feel like im not real.

My dr is aware of all of this and today she told me we will do SMR protocol minute by minute and see how it goes. The program was called "eeger" I think that's the name of the protocol provider. First minute was fine, nothing happened. The second minute I started to space out badly and it freaked me out i told her im dissociating. Im not sure if this is normal or not but I told her im spacing out badly and she stopped everything. This destabilized me and shortly after I started crying because I felt so hopeless. Im not sure if all this happened because I am super hypervigilant of every miniscule thing that goes on in my head or maybe it wasn't the right protocol. I just know I was so depressed and low from the time of the session (11 am) till 7pm in the evening. Can a professional please tell me what is going? I really want neurofeedback to work for me. I even sold my car so I can afford these sessions (im in sweden, doing sessions with a private psychotherapist who has a PhD and specializes in trauma and has extensive experience with neurofeedback).

Thank you!

I am doing neurofeedback home training under supervision. Now I am sometimes allowed to do a session every day, but after 2 or 3 days I notice that my head is completely foggy and heavy. I am afraid that this is due to the protocol and that neurofeedback isn't working. Or can you also become overtrained?

I am doing it for insomnia. Or well, it is more the fear that I won't be able to sleep that is causing me to fail. I have high beta central and high alpha frontal. We are training this down on CZ and I have done it on C4 for a week now, but I don't feel any better doing so. On CZ, I noticed very occasionally that falling asleep went well because I didn't have those intrusive thoughts like: I have to sleep, am I falling asleep yet, etc. This lasted for two nights and then stopped. Is that normal? Sleeping through the night is not working yet anyway. I also have low delta, but according to the trainer, that is not the cause.

TLDR: I have a very complex medical and mental health history, and I feel like my neurofeedback provider is playing a trial and error game with my sites and protocols. She is also very dismissive, demeaning and rude. It’s the only neurofeedback provider in the area, and it has been helping. I’m at a loss for what to do though.

Hi everyone! I have been doing neurofeedback 2 times a week for 10 months, and just started alpha theta 3 months ago, so I’ve had 3 sessions. I have a multitude of symptoms I’ve been doing neurofeedback for, including dysautonomia, POTS, epilepsy, cPTSD (with repressed memories that are continuing to resurface), Panic Disorder, MDD, and GAD.

I’m getting more and more of a feeling that my neurofeedback provider has very limited experience and training. She has had to try many different sites to make any difference in any of my symptoms. It has worked, but it does feel like she’s playing a trial and error frame with me.

She is barely in the office as well. She has a partner (who is very nice and sociable) who does all the work around the office. When she is in the office, she acts like I’m not even there and she hasn’t said a word to me in person since the intake session. I do communicate through email with her but she is very dismissive and what she tells me does not match up with the research I do.

For example, a month ago I had alpha theta and it caused memories to resurface from my trauma and caused me great anxiety, panic, and increase in suicidal ideation and flashbacks. I recently messaged her and told her this as well as that I was hesitant to do another alpha theta session because of this. She responded with, “Alpha theta is not known for increasing symptoms, but I guess we’ll continue to try ILF until symtpoms are more stable.”

She is very dismissive and passive aggressive and I just dislike her. She mentioned that she used to be a therapist before doing nuerofeedback and I thought to myself “no wonder you transferred to neuro, because if I were your client, I’d immediately leave.”

Anyways… sorry this was so long, but I’m really at a loss of what to do, suggest or ask her. Because I hate interacting with her. neurofeedback has helped a lot of my symptoms, but this is the only Neurofeedback provider within 100+ miles. I feel like she doesn’t have experience to work with cases as complex as mine and what she tells me is constantly different that what the research I’ve done says.

What do I do?? Please help!

Hi everyone,

I have some background in traditional frequency-based neurofeedback, but I’m now interested in the Othmer Method, especially ILF training with Cygnet/NeuroAmp.

I’d like to hear from people who have actually used it.

• Are state changes during sessions usually noticeable?
• Does ILF/Cygnet reduce the amount of active adjustment or monitoring compared with conventional amplitude training?
• How much skill and clinical judgment are still required?
• Did it feel like a real shift from traditional neurofeedback?

I’m considering an introductory course and would really appreciate honest, practical impressions.

Thank you.

TL,DR symptoms worsening significantly, including SI ad SH, but practitioner says this is common and we should continue without adjusting because people often feel worse before feeling better with neurofeedback.

I've been taking part in twice weekly neurofeedback for 4+ months, around 30 sessions, based on my qeeg. My main goal is to help with constant, unrelenting rumination, as well as anxiety and general dysregulation. I've been diagnosed with MDD, GAD, OCD, ADHD, and PMDD. I have not yet found relief from any of my symptoms despite years of trying many advanced treatments, including TMS, ketamine, psychedelics, every prescription, and hundreds and hundreds of hours of individual therapy.

There were no changes after about 20 sessions of ISF; ISF was chosen with the idea that it would be a bottoms-up approach at providing my system with a sense of safety and regulation before pursuing other nfb.

Since there was no improvement, we switched to SMR with it being described as a top-down road to safety and regulation. I've done 10+ sessions now.

My symptoms are worsening, and I am basically non-functioning. My rumination has become intolerable to the point that I cannot follow the plot of a children's movie, I struggle to complete basic home tasks, or follow conversations with my kids. I have increased pain and tension in my neck, jaw, shoulders and back, hips and pelvic floor. I'm exhausted and hopeless.

SI has increased drastically, as has SH - to a dangerous point.

My practitioner tells me this can be normal and expected. She indicated that I actually AM now feeling safe and regulated, but since safety/regulation is new to my brain and body, my nervous system is confused and incorrectly identifying unfamiliar with unsafe, and so I'm not yet perceiving the improvement.

She suggested I complete at least 10 more sessions of SMR.

If I supposedly "feel safe", but can't actually sense the safety, what's the point? It'd be like if somebody gave me a pill and told me "your depression has been cured, you just can't tell because your depression symptoms haven't changed"

Another practitioner looked at my QEEG and suggested alpha theta training. The first practitioner didn't want to do that until I was regulated and safe because it might be destabilizing, but I've heard others suggest it specifically to help feel more calm and regulated.

Thoughts?

Hi! I would be so grateful for any help/knowledge!

I recently started neurofeedback and have a few questions.

I had a qEEG with LORETA and have competed 10 sessions of neurofeedback with protocol reducing 2-8 hertz at Fz and T6. I had another qEEG and have just started a protocol to inhibit 2-6 hertz at F3/C3 (she said kind of between them) and T6.

The neurofeedback involves them placing a few electrodes on my ears and 2 on my scalp at measured points, and then I watch a movie. The movie picture and sound quality changes depending on how 'favourably' my brain behaves.

What kind of training is this? I think it might be Z score but I'm not sure. What kind of symptoms might this training be helpful for? Has anyone has anything similar and did it help?

I have ptsd and struggle with anxiety, dissociation and exaggerated startle reflex. I also have adhd but this isn't my presenting complaint.

Thanks so much for reading and for any help!

I’ve briefly heard of neurofeedback but I’m not entitle sure what it is. I’m honestly not a fan of Brainy explanations to trauma healing but I’ve heard good things about neurofeedback and I’m not too familiar with how or why it works.