r/OnePieceSpoilers

As a Sanji Fan, I feel like Oda is Failing Zoro

As a Sanji Fan, I feel like Oda is Failing Zoro

Of course zoro has his fan base, it might even be top 3 if not THE largest fan based, but even his fans believe Sanji is WRITTEN better.

Wano COULDVE been when we learned more about zoros family tree, his connection to Wano, ryuma, and how his family got to his home island in the east blue, WHILE ALSO tying in his growth and identity as a conqueror

But instead he aura farmed for a dozen chapters, got a new sword, and a girl.

THEN after he didn’t get the family backstory… ODA RELEASED ALL THE INFO IN AN SBS.

I don’t hate Wano, I just feel like zoros story was rushed, and that’s not what he need especially amid complaints that post timeskip zoro “has no personality and was reduced to corny one liners”.

Edit: the comments reminded me that everyone values different things in story telling, and more importantly, just like with luffy, zoros family tree isn’t what’s important to his story, “whats important is who he is now and who he will become” and that’s not tied to his family tree the same way sanjis growth is tied to his because Zoros story isn’t hindered or led by his family history, it’s led by his ambitions

Quote from u/Delver_Razade ‘s comment

u/IceNo782 — 5 hours ago

Chapter 1188 Predictions Post

Leave your predictions (maximum of 3) for the next chapter in the comments below.

🏆 At the end of the year, the top two members who get more points will win an extra-special-rare custom user flair.

🔒 We'll lock the post when the hints come out.

You want to AVOID giving out VAGUE or OBVIOUS predictions. Check the pinned comment for examples.

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u/MuriloZR — 10 hours ago

Quick question about how Imu’s voice would be in the anime

(Sorry for bad quality 😅)
So in the current anime, Imu speaks in this weird filter right ? So when we get into the moment Imu appears on Elbaf… would he speak normally or would there still be the filter ?

u/IlikeAwarmCoffee — 5 hours ago

Sanji needs to accept he’s a vinsmoke to awaken his coc

I believe with sanji he needs to truly accept himself to awaken the coc.
Scopper told him he has the traits of the king but his doubts hold him back.

I also think it’s not coincidence that we see the swan versions of the vinsmokes in the cover of this chapter.

Sanji doesn’t need to forgive his father or brothers but he has to accept he is a vinsmoke but decides to own the name and make it his own.

Back in wano when momo was being crucified, kaido tells him to deny his name and he will let him go.
Momo shouts out that his name is kozuki momosuki and he will be shogun of wano.
Sanji saves him and tells him how cool it was of him to shout his name out like that.

Later when he’s fighting queen he begins demonstrating his germa powers and has a panic attack and runs away, he destroys his raid suit to truly cut off his connection to his father.

I believe this is a problem. Having a panic attack cause he showed traits of his family and running away from a fight is not good.

In order for sanji to become a king he must accept who he truly is, he must accept he is a vinsmoke but to turn that into a strength not a weakness, he will do it by declaring that he will make it so everyone thinks of him when they hear the name vinsmoke not think of judge.

The vinsmoke name will be associated with heroism not villainy. He will take away all power judge holds over him

u/MrBushido56 — 11 hours ago

Sanji is not only going to awaken his Conqueror's Haki but he is also going to awaken Observation Killing... Now hear me out. (My parlay prediction)

In Wano, it was shown that Zoro had/revealed Conqueror's Haki as well as being able to use Conqueror's Haki coating before Luffy used it. Sure at first he used it unconsciously and briefly before finally using it against King, and even in that fight he still didn't know he was using Conqueror's Haki coating but that does not change the fact that he used it before Luffy.

You can even say that his attack with Kaido serve as a hint on what was the next advance stage of Conqueror's Haki. At this point, the only stage left in Conqueror's Haki is Observation Haki which Shanks uses, since there is new level of Conqueror's Haki for the Holy Knight's immortality.

It's pretty much certain that Luffy will have to face/meet Shanks at one point during the following arcs and Shanks to this day is the only character that is known to use Observation Killing. For Luffy to become Pirate King he will need to surpass even Shanks and it wouldn't make sense for Luffy to Surpass Shanks without being able to use Observation Killing, like how he surpassed Katakuri by learning Future Sight, Luffy will surpass Shanks by learning Observation Killing.

This is why I believe Sanji is going to awaken Observation Killing during his fight with Killingham, he isn't going to master it or realize what he just awaken. Like how Zoro didn't know he was using Conqueror's Haki coating and believe he was just using regular Armament Haki but in a larger quantity due to Enma, Sanji is going to mistaken Observation Killing for the regular effects of Conqueror's Haki which is the stunning and knocking someone out (I am exagerating the comparison but that is to make my point clear).

This would work in great parallel with Sanji and Zoro being the wings of the future Pirate King (Luffy) because for a bird to rise further above (A.K.A fly or in Luffy's case reach his dream), its wings (Sanji/Zoro) have to go above it at first to carry it higher in the sky when they go down (like when they defeat enemies or obstacles in Luffy's way).

u/Large_Payment632 — 6 hours ago

Who is Gaban talking to when he says: "Looks like there's more than one of you with CoC"?

Here are the possible intereprations:

(1) Gaban is initially referring to Zoro. He only comments on Sanji's potential CoC after Sanji asks him directly

(2) Gaban is initially referring to Sanji. He already knew that Luffy and Zoro had CoC, so there would be no point in mentioning Zoro having CoC again.

(3) Gaban initially refers to BOTH Zoro and Sanji. "Looks like there's more than one of you [aside from Luffy] with CoC [and it's Zoro and Sanji].

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u/WonPlease — 6 hours ago

Luffy will learn how to tie knots

Luffy will learn how to tie knots to protect the crew members who don't have CoC from the Knights. It will give them the ability to teleport the Knights whenever they're in danger.

u/123hwdp — 10 hours ago

Do you think there will be a big twist/reveal from Shuri’s POV of her past?

It looks like Shuri will be free from the ice within the next couple of chapters. With Imu busy fighting Luffy and Brook trying to spark memories of her past, she might be able to (at least temporarily) regain control. The end of Brook’s flashback was him realizing Shuri might be a victim as well, and choosing to believe in her and help her and I think she’ll give her recount of the past to explain herself.

With what we know now, reading between the lines, it looks like Gurou assaulted Candelle, Reuven married her to protect her and her child, Shuri’s eyes awakened, WG demands and later invades to capture her, Imu DR’s both her and Reuven to influence Shuri to kill her family/leave her kingdom. It is possible her flashback will just be her being told by Gurou/Mars/Imu that she’s a Manmayer, her refusing to abandon her father (Reuven) and kingdom, then Imu DR Reuven to scare her/say hurtful things then Imu DR Shuri and never undoing it/forcing a covenant, essentially creating Gunko. Keeps the story moving, and reconfirms Shuri is a victim.

But there are a lot of vague points/questions that make me think we will get more than that. Did someone tip off the WG about Shuri’s eyes? We know “word spread” about Shuri, but Gurou confirmed they only picked her up because Shuri’s eyes were ”awakened”, while his heterochromia eyes are not, so how did they know her eyes were awakened? Did Imu sense it? Also, while I have no doubt CD’s would assault people and just leave, Gurou remembers Candelle and even recognizes her attendants? Garling fooled Shank’s mother for a bit, but he tried to take Shanks/Shammrock when they were babies, not 16. Also, why was Imu there? I get Mars is probably responsible for the fog, but Imu being there “in person” makes me think there is more to this. Candelle as a whole is a wild card to me with the whole ”trusted blade/in love with a man much higher than me” lines. I’m not saying she’s evil. I have this crazy idea she might be Gurou’s castoff daughter (like how Bonney was castoff) and Gurou might have recognized her and forced an experiment (like how Saturn experimented on Bonney) or covenant on her to make her bed ridden.

Given Shuri is basically the personal attendant of Imu, I think she is pretty important, at least as a tool. At the very least, I think Oda will use Shuri as a bit of a lore dump on the CD‘s since she is the the first one that could turn face to be a Straw Hat ally.

u/Jmeister2504 — 10 hours ago

Luffy got himself Whitebeard, and it's Loki

Many people said Luffy's rival pirate is Katakuri, honestly until Elbaf arc, it was likable theory, but now in Elbaf arc, Loki suits this more than Katakuri. Loki and Luffy have some rivalry like relationship, both of them admire Xebec and Shanks at same level, and Jarul's myth led to me thinking that Nidhogg and Nika used to be rivals back then but due to Imu's influence, they became enemies. What do you guys think

(Image credit to Pablitros on Reddit)

u/Suspicious-Glove648 — 22 hours ago

Those who joined later in the series what theories did you have that went absolutely nowhere?

I was sure Shanks was gonna die since I saw luffy get a black cloak just like his which I thought luffy kept after shanks' death, now I know they didnt even meet yet

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u/Wise-Ship7692 — 13 hours ago

Usopp could get Ragnar but die

In the new chapter Loki is out of commission but Ragnar is pretty close to the crew, and since a lot of usopp’s lies come true something could happen to make him use Ragnar. What I think will happen is Luffy will run out of time on gear 5 and pass out. But Usopp could use Ragnar as a last ditch effort to save Luffy and hold Imu back fulling his dream of being a brave warrior. But this could lead to Usopp getting killed by Imu just in time for Luffy to crash out and use gear 5 to its fullest extent to get rid of Imu. Or Usopp could continue to keep being a bum and not do anything on the island he wanted to go to and let Brooke take his arc.

u/Beeboparoo20 — 17 hours ago

I think I know how Luffy vs Imu is gonna end, & Oda set it up back in the climax of Egghead

I think we can all agree Luffy is not going to win against Imu here, at least not yet, due to narrative importance & Imu’s strength that’s been displayed so far.

However even with this in mind, I think I know how this fight will end; Luffy’s goal here isn’t to outright beat Imu, it’s as he said very upfront to Imu in chapter 1186: “YOU GET OUT… …OF ELBAPH… …RIGHT NOW!!” And he has (or at the very least knows) the best method how to do so; the Solo Sky Split.

One key & consistent trait of Luffy across the series is that he always takes notes of new Haki applications; Rayleigh & Hagoro with armament & its advanced applications, Katakuri with Future Sight & most recently, inferring of what he knows with Advanced Armament, Advanced Conquers Haki. Tldr: if Luffy sees a new haki technique he doesn’t know about or have, he’ll keep it in mind & later learn it & use it to his advantage.

The only haki technique he hasn’t learned is the Solo Sky Split, remember, unlike everyone else on Egghead, he saw what Joyboys Solo Sky Split did to the Gorosei; it forced them back to the Holy Land, or to Luffys knowledge, forced them to disappear. With this in mind & Gabans words, I think Luffy will reach the peak of Conqueror’s Haki in the climax of his fight with Imu to get him off of Elbaph. That way Luffys haki reaches his peak for the Final War & the only thing he’ll have to focus on is his mastery over his Awakening, which in turn will get him closer to becoming King of the Pirates.

u/Ok_Internet2705 — 1 day ago

Which situation will end first?

There are 3 situations that need to be solved. Of course Luffy vs Imu is at the out of the question because is the last one.

  1. Zoro defeating Sommers (The bastard is too lazy to defeat Zoro)
  2. Sanji Smashing Killingham again with his New Conqueror's Haki (Because he can't fight against Zaza despite being a fake woman)
  3. Gunko's situation being solved (Of course will be drama there because Loki will want to kill her and Brook will try to save her)

Is Impossible that the script gives the victory to the world government at least Shamrock would return but of course that even more imposible.

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u/LordRydro44 — 1 day ago

Honestly at this point in the story not many things should scare Usopp

Honestly, at this point in the story, very few things should genuinely scare Usopp anymore. With everything he’s lived through the monsters he’s fought, the islands he’s survived he should be WAY less scared.

He’s been blown up, crushed, chased, nearly killed, and thrown into situations that would break normal people instantly. He’s fought in wars, infiltrated enemy territory, and stood his ground even when he was shaking. After all that, being scared of things like falling, really big animals or extreme heights shouldn’t hit him the same way anymore.

That doesn’t mean he has to stop being Usopp, he can still panic, still overthink, still get nervous. Fear is part of his charm. But the scale of what frightens him should be different now. He’s grown past the point where everyday dangers send him spiraling. His fear should be reserved for things that are hella insane or outrageous, not just physically intimidating.

u/Additional_Day_2274 — 1 day ago

A significant chunk of people saying “Sanji won’t get CoC, instead he’ll get some really cool alternative” were Zoro fans in disguise

Seeing people trying to gate keep Sanji from having CoC was just strange. The strangest form of this gatekeeping was Zoro fans in disguise who’d push the “he’ll get some really cool alternative!” agenda, who knew deep down that Sanji having CoC IS the coolest possible power up he could get. Zoro fans are just insecure about this because Sanji getting CoC is strong evidence that Oda wants to keep Zoro and Sanji on the same level.

PS: Read the title - I am not saying EVERYONE who didn’t want Sanji to have CoC are Zoro fans. I’m sure there are non-Zoro fans who don’t want Sanji to have CoC.

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u/-HxH- — 1 day ago

Sanji's CoC awakening will be when his original dream is rekindled

I was reading u/qwertymerty111 's theory on how Sanji will become "King of Heaven" and it got me thinking about what would Heaven even be like for Sanji. Of course, there'd be women in it, but that's not all Sanji's character is made out of.

The reason Sanji joined the crew besides his synergy with the crew was because he always dreamed of the All Blue, the sea with everything him as a sea chef could ever want. A chef's paradise. To me, that's his Heaven, to become the King of Heaven, he needs to find Heaven and claim it, meaning he needs to find the All Blue. Perfect close knot on his dreams as an ambition worthy of a King.

However, as the story went on, we heard less and less of those ambitions. While other characters like Zoro and Luffy will claim their dreams loud and clear "I will be the greatest swordsman" and "I will be King of the Pirates", Sanji literally lets that be buried in his other traits, that he's a pervert, a prince, an empathetic person, a science freak...

He talks about "Love" this and "Love" that but he can't afford to show his own original dream any love? Not only that but the self recrimination from being a Germa super soldier project and in particular the fear that he himself would lose himself in that whole science deal and become a monster like he showed in Wano fighting Queen... These two points can explain very cleanly why Sanji is unable to use Conqueror's Haki, if he has it.

He's suppressing it. Out of fear, worry and self-recrimination Sanji is suppressing his own ambitions under the guise of

"not becoming a monster/ceding to his Germa heritage", of

"my love for women is my biggest trait/losing the point as to why he aspires to become a true gentleman to begin with", of

"my dream might never happen/no clues as to the All Blue all this time".

He fled his home because he was not only weak, but wanted to pursue cooking instead of being a soldier. He got his real father because he was that dedicated to cooking and survived the opposite of a cook's dream, dying of hunger. He learned to be who he is today because he wanted the tutelage of a great chef and to work in a fine dining restaurant. He became a Straw Hat because he wanted to find the All Blue and be able to cook with wonderful ingredients from all of the different seas. He stayed in his own personal hell of Kamabaka island because he wanted to learn the secrets of their cooking!

But Sanji never lets himself notice that, he always puts another reason forward, like: "I was hated as a child", "I was eternally grateful to Zeff", "I don't want to bring trouble to the Hats" yadda yadda yadda. Back in Baratie, Zeff had to throw him out for him to go after his own dream, damn it! He's always been the type of person to place himself in second place to other things.

Fighting Killingham now though is the best chance he'll ever get at realizing he's being stupid all this time for not pursuing his own dream.

Killingham will show Sanji his own nightmare incarnate, and I can bet right here right now that it won't be a scary woman, an Okama or even the betrayal of his own crew, it'll be something to do with cooking and himself. It'll be a mirror match of the Sanji that we see now and a Sanji that's "better" in every way but does not put his cooking in first place, where cooking is a means to an end of women, friends and companionship. From there Sanji will have to get over his own sorry ass and awaken his Conqueror's.

u/Kioga101 — 1 day ago