u/LS3624

Create the Elite 8 slashers then make your way down to the King Killer. This should be based on current overall popular cultural impact and influence.

Elite 8: Freddy, Jason, Michael, Leatherface, Art, Pennywise, Chucky, Ghostface

Malignant 7: Freddy, Jason, Michael, Art, Pennywise, Chucky, Ghostface

Slasher 6: Freddy, Jason, Michael, Art, Chucky, Ghostface

Filleting 5: Freddy, Jason, Michael, Art, Ghostface

Mount Slashmore: Freddy, Jason, Michael, Ghostface

Trio of Terror: Jason, Freddy, Gostface

Terrible Two: Jason, Ghostface

King Killer: Ghostface

I see many lists and qualifications of what is and is not a Batman film. To me the film must be in the post-Dark Knight Returns era (1986) of Batman. I call this the Modern Dark Knight Era Batman Films.

Thus the 1940s serials and the campy 1966 film are out. They represent an archaic, different era of Batman. A completely different character IMHO.

Second the film must feature Batman as the main/title character. Thus ensemble films like Suicide Squad, ZSJL, The Flash, and the 2 Lego non-Batman titled films are out.

Finally, the film must have had a full theatrical release. So the handful animated films that DC released in a limited fashion don’t count.

Above is my list of 11 (soon to be 12) films that I feel make the list of true Batman films of the modern era.

Thoughts?

Here is my Batman film villain tier list. It’s based upon theatrically released live action films where Batman appears and battles villains.

I was going to do just solo films, or just traditional Batman villains, but I realized that left Ben Affleck’s Batman out entirely. So I expanded it to include all live action Batman film appearances. I also chose to limit it to the modern “Dark Knight” interpretation of the character so ‘66 and ‘40’s serials are out. As are all animated versions.

So there are 12 films in total that meet this criteria:
Batman (1989)
Batman Returns (1992)
Batman Forever (1995)
Batman and Robin (1997)
Batman Begins (2005)
The Dark Knight (2008)
The Dark Knight Rises (2012)
Batman v. Superman: Dawn of Justice Ultimate Edition (2016)
Suicide Squad: Extended Cut (2016)
Zack Snyder’s Justice League (2021)
The Flash (2023)
The Batman (2022)

While only 8, or 9 depending upon how you view BvS, are solo Batman films they all feature Batman fighting villains in some capacity. So they all count.

I included all traditional Batman villains (Joker, Two-Face. Penguin, etc.) of course. I also included all villains who were central to the plot and major antagonists, even if they weren’t traditional costumed villains like Max Shreck and Carmine Falcone. I included tertiary villains if they were actual comic book villains but just had a small antagonistic role in the film like Mr. Zsaaz, Barry Keoghan’s Joker, and Darkseid. I added the category “INS” for Insufficient for the characters who didn’t have enough screen time to warrant a ranking.

I opted not to include Billy Dee Williams’ Harvey Dent for TWO (get it?) reasons. Number 1 he is never a villain in that film. Number 2, technically speaking, Tommy Lee Jones’ Two-Face IS Billy Dee’s Harvey because it’s in the same universe (or at least was supposed to be). I also didn’t include Amanda Waller because she was never antagonist towards Batman.

Finally while Dark Flash doesn’t battle Batman directly, he is responsible for Batman (and Supergirl) dying multiple times. So, fun fact, he’s killed Batman more than any other villain on this list combined! So he’s earned his spot.

For me the Klassic Mortal Kombat story was the original arcade games 1-4. I see 9 and 10 as the Ultimate versions of those stories. 11 is the culmination of that original storyline. There is a through line from Shang Tsung to Shao Kahn to Shinnok to Kronika that crested an increasingly greater threat to the realms. Thus my ideal roster would include all the characters from all of those games. Think of it as the Ultimate version of the last trilogy of games 9-11.

In reality Bi Han Sub-Zero would be a skin of Noob Saibot, Cyber Sub-Zero would be a skin of Kuai Liang Sub-Zero, Cyber Smoke would be a skin of Smoke, Corrupted Shinnok would be a skin of Shinnok, and Fire God Liu Kang would be a skin of Liu Kang but since their move sets are different, and I wanted to showcase the totality of the roster, I put them in as separate slots.

Thoughts?

I know, I know Alice In Chains isn’t even in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame yet (and that MUST happen next). But hear me out…

The Screaming Trees are the 5th most mainstream successful Seattle Grunge band for sure. Mark Lanegan is rock vocal god on par with Kurt, Chris, Eddie, and Layne. Is it time we formally anoint the Trees into the S Tier of Seattle?

I think so. Thoughts?

Okay this is take two. My first offering was met with critique so I’m back with a revised format. I present to you the Freddy vs Jason narrative broken down into a thematic phased watch order.

If you like this let me know. If you have critiques that’s fine, talk them out. But please don’t just be a random fly-by dick.

The narrative flows very well with little interruption. Only Jason Takes Manhattan’s rough transition to JGTH and Jason X require some head canon. I proposed leaving Manhattan out of the saga but many complained. So I consider it an optional watch. I left it in for those who like it. Make your own story as to how it makes sense to the greater narrative.

As to Jason X it’s included because I see it as an epilogue to FvJ. How? I’ll give some props to YouTuber The Haddonfield Registry (The Definitive Lore Accurate Friday the 13th Timeline) for showing me how. He explains that Freddy entering Jason fundamentally altered Jason. It made him able to regenerate, as we see in Jason X.

I believe that the ending of FvJ and the wink by Freddy also adds upon this. You see Freddy, now dead in the outside world, now lives solely in Jason’s head. Jason’s mom is no longer calling the shots, Freddy is. It’s an odd couple dynamic for sure but as Jason emerges from the lake holding Freddy’s head through their joint incineration entering Earth 2’s atmosphere, they are inexorably linked. How? As Freddy was physically dying on the dock at Crystal Lake, Jason lost consciousness and Freddy was able to sneak back into the big killing machine’s head. The evidence to consider is that Jason is far more whimsical and personality filled, by his standards, in Jason X than in prior films. This is Freddy’s influence.

This idea adds a whole new element to watching Jason X, which is already a surprisingly fun watch. Watch it right after FvJ and let me know what you think. I see it as the true end to Jason and Freddy.

Above is my proposed timeline for the Freddy vs Jason saga. I’ve divided it into 6 “Phases”. Phase 1: Jason’s Origins and First Rampage, Phase 2: Freddy’s Origins and First Rampage, Phase 3: Undead Jason, Phase 4: Expanding Freddy’s Lore, Phase 5: To Hell with Freddy and Jason, and Phase 6: Monster Rally.

These 14 films represent a narrative that is continuous and builds towards a crossover between the two slasher titans. You’ll notice I’ve excluded films that don’t fit into this narrative saga. These films are either in a separate continuity (WCNN, F13 2009, & ANOES 2010) or are so disruptive to the timeline/narrative, and devoid of quality, that I deem them non-canon (F13 5, F13 8, and ANOES 2). These exclusions do not have a bearing on the story and thus can be skipped.

Some may argue that F13 3 and 7 are not particularly story/plot filled but I’d argue that they do add to the overall story. 3 is clearly the day after 2 and a few days before 4. It also explains Jason’s hockey mask and damage going into later films. 7 introduces Jason to battling magical beings which will come into play with Freddy later, gives him gnarly battle damage that is reflected in 9, leaves him at Crystal Lake which is where we find him in the beginning of 9, and introduced us to the Kane Hodder style of Jason that appears again in 9 & 10.

As to Jason X it’s included because I see it as an epilogue to FvJ. How? I’ll give some props to YouTuber The Haddonfield Registry (The Definitive Lore Accurate Friday the 13th Timeline) for showing me how. He explains that Freddy entering Jason fundamentally altered Jason. It made him able to regenerate, as we see in Jason X.

I believe that the ending of FvJ and the wink by Freddy also adds upon this. You see Freddy, now dead in the outside world, now lives solely in Jason’s head. Jason’s mom is no longer calling the shots, Freddy is. It’s an odd couple dynamic for sure but as Jason emerges from the lake holding Freddy’s head through their joint incineration entering Earth 2’s atmosphere, they are inexorably linked. How? As Freddy was physically dying on the dock at Crystal Lake, Jason lost consciousness and Freddy was able to sneak back into the big killing machine’s head. The evidence to consider is that Jason is far more whimsical and personality filled, by his standards, in Jason X than in prior films. This is Freddy’s influence.

This idea adds a whole new element to watching Jason X, which is already a surprisingly fun watch. Watch it right after FvJ and let me know what you think. I see it as the true end to Jason and Freddy.

This film always leaves me wondering where in the Universal Monsters family it belongs.

It’s 23 years after The Creature Walks Among Us which is generally considered the last of the Classic Era. It’s 20 years before The Mummy/Van Helsing Sommers Action/Adventure Era. And it’s way before the 2010’s remake/ Dark Universe Era.

At the end of the day I see it as the last attempt to resurrect the Classic Era. It is a gothic horror to be sure and it still tries to maintain some of the feel of the original series. So I guess I’ll place it there? I think it should be included with any future classic package release in much the same way that the 1943 Phantom is included; especially with the 1931 Dracula going into Public Domain soon. Release the 34 film collection!